Leaving friends behind.

How is life after RSE? What negative effects are you dealing with? How has it affected loved ones? What has helped you towards healing and moving on? Share with others here.
FreeNow
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Leaving friends behind.

Unread post by FreeNow » Sun Jan 06, 2008 4:50 am

I made friends with a few people who live in Yelm and I really grew to love them. I haven't told them yet. I wonder if I should just let them go and not answer any emails or tell them which would really upset them. I feel anxiety over this. I know they will be really disappointed in me and I know it shouldn't matter. But I miss them.
Keep the greater good at heart.

Lost in Space
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Unread post by Lost in Space » Sun Jan 06, 2008 4:59 am

That is so sad.
I think, though, that if they are truly your friends, they will remain your friends.

Whatchamacallit
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Unread post by Whatchamacallit » Sun Jan 06, 2008 5:23 am

One particular "friend" that I had in RSE, whom I knew prior to RSE, turned her back on me when I left. She stopped returning phone calls, etc. Just cut off. A few others hung in there, until they realized that I wasn't going to return at the time of my mandatory event. Then, that was the end of them, also.

There is encouragement in the teachings to disassociate from "villagers" (non-current students, or those who haven't been students). Don't want their unenlightened energy near you, you know. Or those "quitters", who left RSE.

With the attitude toward those who leave RSE, by the ones who are current, being as negative as it is, it's a real friend who sticks with a relationship with a former member. Rather, I should say, it's more likely to be a real friend. I'd say only time will tell for sure.

FreeNow, you're going to learn who your real friends are. It was an uncomfortable thing for me to go through, so I understand. Knowing they are going to be disappointed, doesn't help, either. You will get through it, though. Wiser, and hopefully, not hurt. They may try hard to keep you in the "school", too. I went through that. I had quite a bit of pressure along that line, actually. GOOD LUCK.

FreeNow
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Leaving friends behind.

Unread post by FreeNow » Sun Jan 06, 2008 6:02 am

Well, I could follow their own advice and not say anything. Their advice was not to tell people certain information because it takes away their ability to find out the information for themselves. :wink:
Keep the greater good at heart.

Tyger

Unread post by Tyger » Sun Jan 06, 2008 6:09 am

Free;

What your friends are telling you is a crock. Effective and prevalent communication prevents wars and furthers mankind. Too bad feminized America hasn't realized this yet. Keep talking. It's your birthright.

Lost in Space
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Unread post by Lost in Space » Sun Jan 06, 2008 6:17 am

Feminized America, Tyger? You are saying that woman don't talk much or know how to communicate?
Aw, well, for a different reason, I think you should tell them when you are ready, because deception will seem worse to them than defection. "It is easier to seek forgiveness than permission".

Tyger

Unread post by Tyger » Sun Jan 06, 2008 6:26 am

Lost;

Obviously it's not a crack on women. Otherwise my angelic marriage would suffer greatly, don't you think? But it's hardly rocket science that since Western European males began acting like little girls that society has changed, and in radical ways.

There simply are no role models available for men anymore. Being "macho" has been turned into a crime. And this planet will suffer greatly for that decision. It already is.

Lost in Space
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Unread post by Lost in Space » Sun Jan 06, 2008 7:19 am

I am thinking about what you have said.
Obviously you have a great deal of personal integrity, and it is a matter you feel very strongly about, the lack of role models for young men today. Could you maybe post that as a topic on its own?
I think the shift away from the "Macho" has resulted from the horror and recoil resulting from the effects of the World Wars and subsequent wars - if that was what being manly meant, and resulted in, a lot of people said - NO, we don't want that. Never again. Trying to figure out what it truly means to be a man, people have been blundering about ever since.
But we have veered away from the original topic.
Why should or shouldn't Freenow tell his friends in RSE that he is leaving or has left?

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G2G
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Unread post by G2G » Sun Jan 06, 2008 8:52 am

8) Freenow, you don't have to hide, just tell them when and if you're ready, be it now, or be it much later. You will know when the time is right. When one is truly free, it's their decision. I've told my friends who were in my beginner's, and learned they, too, had quit, one before the other. She still was my friend even though I'd quit, and we used to quietly discuss our feelings about some of the teachings which made us feel uncomfortable. One case: when the people ran across the field blindfolded and were injured, and those who were not injured were NOT permitted to offer sympathy, assist, or even look at those who were injured. According to "R" it was their own creation? Neither of us bought that and concurred we probably would have been kicked out because it's second nature for the both of us to just stop and help. And no one was going to change that very part of our personal nature. Good luck to you and be happy - live free! You can now FACE the sunrise instead of turning away from it. :D
"I never really understood religion - it just seemed a good excuse to give" - Ten Years After circa 1972

See&E
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Unread post by See&E » Tue Jan 08, 2008 1:38 am

Friendships & Belief

Dear FreeNow,

One of the things I miss most from attending events at the ranch, was also the great fun and friendships that were developed from all walks of life, from all over the world. We all had the 'journey' and the school, and our expectations and individual reasons for coming there, and for returning. In time, the repetition became familiar, and some friends became like family. When I left the school, there were indeed a half dozen or maybe more that tried to pursuade me in coming back. You will likely find that there are indeed one or two that may even (in time) continue the friendship, and it will evolve. In fact, I've had some great travels in the years after y-land, and was treated like royalty by friends from school. A few have even come to visit me. Apart from an occaissional 'ssshhhh' or "this event is over, you may remove your blinders", or various attempts at impersonations in light-hearted fun by them when we were enjoying time sharing nature, each others favorite places, my experience is that you'll still find some great friends there. I hope so. You may even serve (over time) to help them. Maybe they never wanted to mention their doubt before.

The main thing is, not to waste your time trying to convince them, let them do the asking. Just be "freenow" indeed, and be happy. There is no greater magnet than a smile, joy, laughter, and a light-hearted attitude about life. That has always been true.

Still, you're right, there will be some, perhaps, that leave your life, but just because one leaves the school, does not mean (necessarily) they have to abandon everything the LOVED about the school, and the teachings. Many, many of those teachings can be found in books, movies, other ways...

The good news is, you never need spend another dime helping someone else with their dream or business. There is no copywrite on friendship, and if you want to make the effort, they may even keep up email, or you may decide it best to move on. Your choice, no runners, no tests.. just choice. ;)

I suspect there are different ways, and cycles for anyone to separate from ANY relationship with people, partners, organizations, family, friends, and that would most definitely include the friends in shool. All the more so, because the school represented something very special to all those who attended. A sincere, fervent desire to know God, or ones relationship with God. That can be beautiful, and no wonder great friendships were made by so many of us!

Follow your heart, be good to yourself, and I'll bet you already know how it's best for you to proceed. But the good news is, you can decide for yourself, when, how, if, or in how much detail you want to share. They'll probably realize you aren't at events... and if they really care about you (they do) they will let you know.

I just wanted to share that really great things can still develop from the people you met there, and it may just be that 'the best is yet to be' with them.

See&E

Lost in Space
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Unread post by Lost in Space » Tue Jan 08, 2008 1:49 am

:) very encouraging take on things, See& E.

Was also thinking, people in RSE vary, just like friends on the outside.

Remembering when I worked at McDonald's in my teens...thought we were all buds, we were all part of a team, we spent many many hourse together and shared many many experiences. As soon as I left, if I went in to see them, there was a chill, a distance with some of them. I was no longer part of the team. But some remained my friends.
Or, it's like any school friendship. We grow and change over the years. Some of my school friends are still my friends. Most of them, we just kinda drifted apart.
Wondering if RSE is so very different from other social settings.
Anyone else want to share about that?

FreeNow
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Unread post by FreeNow » Tue Jan 08, 2008 5:15 am

Thank you everyone for your heart felt answers. I'm thinking the sooner the better. Just need to work on the wording. :)
Keep the greater good at heart.

wolfman

Unread post by wolfman » Wed Jan 09, 2008 4:09 am

Non Servian

mature viewing advised

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4nUFxsZqpA

Tyger

Unread post by Tyger » Wed Jan 09, 2008 7:21 am

Free;

As you all know from my previous posts, I am working with a great friend of mine who is desperately trying to get his own thoughts, mind, and life back from Scamtha. He is very much still programmed. About 90% of the words he speaks are nearly direct quotes from the demon himself. I'm not even sure how much of his own soul or self is left.

It's been up and down...

But he's trying....and trying real hard, as near as I can tell. Just 20 minutes ago he came over with his 4-year old son, who had been recently re-enrolled in Scamtha's CSE (Childrens School of Evil), and his son was beaming....

He said, "Uncle Mark, I'm out of Ramtha's school and am gonna be home-schooled now by you and my dad!!!"

I almost burst into tears...

The demon is so desperate for his son's soul that he'd offerred them a full scholarship ($1000.00) just to keep him in. They accepted Satan's offer.

For one whole day. Then Tyger kicked in gear...


I have found two things that work exceptionally well with "Ramsters" and their demonic leader.

1) Scintillating logic and insight generally renders these idiots numb. Their knowledge base is abysmal at best.

2) Reciting the "Lord's Prayer" verbally and in their face will make them run in fear for their very lives, occassionally contemplate homicidal behavior, and every now and then urinate on their Salvation Army fashions.

For those of you who want the "magic wand" against these demons, I will recite, and free of charge...


"OUR FATHER, Who art in Heaven.....Hallowed be Thy name....Thy kingdom come, Thy WILL be done, in Heaven as it is on Earth. Give us this day our daily bread, and forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us, and DELIVER US FROM EVIL.....For Thine is the Kingdom, the Power, and the Glory.....Forever, ...and ever....and ever. Amen."

It has a similar effect on Ramsters as water did on the wicked witch of the west in the classic "Wizard of Oz" movie.

Use it free of charge. :D

FreeNow
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Unread post by FreeNow » Wed Jan 09, 2008 8:16 am

Wow, Tyger, I feel released to sing that prayer again, in the original. Thank you! :D
Keep the greater good at heart.

joe sz
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Unread post by joe sz » Thu Jan 10, 2008 9:52 am

Lost,
good point, er question:
"Wondering if RSE is so very different from other social settings."

That is the point. Cults as closed systems work because the same social influence principles occur and work in more open systems. I believe [along with Robert J Lifton] that cult formation is a matter of degree and not so black and white. If any one of us were stranded with a busfull of strangers in an avalanche we would not only bond for survival but soon get to know intimate things about these folks. The survivors would meet annually, at least for some years. Maybe even make T-shirts :wink:
Think of reciprocity: If a cult recruiter pays inordinate sensitive attention to your life story as a seeker, you will most likely pay attention to her story about her group.

I recall in 1975 when I stopped smoking "weed" or "herb" my entire circle of friends shifted dramatically. And as I knew potheads, they tended to be suspicious of the one in their midst that refused to take a drag.

Yes, leaving a cult means leaving a social set and changing many habits and those friends that no longer share your new habits. If you are not getting high on C&E anymore, it gets increasingly hard for those that do to just hang with you.

Another insight, if I may. I spent a weekend in jail once [over a cult case that backfired] and I taught art in a maximum security pen in NM for nearly a year 15 years before that. Prisoners cluster according to type in general. I noted that when I taught. During my weekend in orange pjs, I was with 4 other Anglos in prison with a majority of Hispanics and a few Blacks. All the Blacks were gone from our pod after a nasty racial fight between Hispanics and Blacks broke out. During recreation I played Horse on the basketball court with the 4 'white' guys while the non-Anglos lifted weights. Under stressful circumstances we will seek "our kind." That is why so many cults create and predict one crisis after another to keep the group bonded. It works really well....

Lifton stated in his book "Thought Reform" that "if he talks like us, he's one of us." He was referring to the loaded language in cults. Once you stop believing in the doctrine and teaching, the esoteric and idiosyncratic jargon that supports it goes away too. It has to. Continued use will trigger re-identification with the cult. Every cult has its special language--some even speak in a kind of code. eg, scientology has an incredible amount of abbeviations that are special to that group only.

Whatchamacallit
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Unread post by Whatchamacallit » Thu Jan 10, 2008 2:14 pm

Joe said, "Yes, leaving a cult means leaving a social set and changing many habits and those friends that no longer share your new habits. If you are not getting high on C&E anymore, it gets increasingly hard for those that do to just hang with you."

So true. Also, to encourage this split in communications and/or friendship between current and ex-students, Ramsters are told to "keep the teachings pure", which means do not speak of them outside of the school. So once a student leaves, and they've officially missed their next required event, they're out of the loop. Many students won't talk. But, the problem with that is, those who do talk, are all that is needed. There are no secrets in Yelm.

I've heard a number of single students tell me that, when looking for a partner, they wouldn't date anyone who wasn't in the school. Talk about being unwilling to broaden one's horizons. Also, this is another example of people wanting to bond with their own kind. Kind, obviously, meaning those that think in agreement with them.

wolfman

Unread post by wolfman » Wed Jan 16, 2008 5:32 am

Whatcha........Binding With Your Own Kind..........

Astutely stated !

Thats what we are all doing here.

We were drawn here for the same reason.

The frequency of the world is vibrating.

Some go to the left.

Some go to the right.

Some become werewolves.

Whatchamacallit
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Unread post by Whatchamacallit » Wed Jan 16, 2008 6:27 am

Certainly so, Wolf. You may have noted that I didn't say it was a "bad" thing, imo. It just is what it is - kindred spirits. Unfortunately, within RSE, it's a very closed system, creating closed minded thinking. Though of course, they believe they are so openminded as to be the Radical Few on the entire planet. As you know, Ramthimher encourages that attitude.

Until he's had too much wine. Then, they are all called axxholes.

I'm sooo glad I'm outta there.


Life is good.

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G2G
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Unread post by G2G » Wed Jan 16, 2008 8:13 am

My perception is what we have in common is we either are ex RSE'ers, or have family and/or friends in RSE or other closed-system, noncritical thinking groups. But beyond that, imo, there is a wide and diverse group of people here offering their own experiences and opinions. We don't all "agree" and stand up with a water bottle saying "YES!" People here voice their experiences and opinions as well as ask questions and don't always see eye-to-eye. I think that's a huge difference between an RSE type of group and an EMF-like forum. My opinion, for what it's worth.
8)
"I never really understood religion - it just seemed a good excuse to give" - Ten Years After circa 1972

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G2G
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Unread post by G2G » Wed Jan 16, 2008 8:15 am

Must add. A HAND for the moderators. They do very well, I believe, in walking a fine line. (wanted to include this in the above post)
:D :D :D
"I never really understood religion - it just seemed a good excuse to give" - Ten Years After circa 1972

Whatchamacallit
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Unread post by Whatchamacallit » Thu Jan 17, 2008 1:17 am

G2G said, "We don't all "agree" and stand up with a water bottle saying "YES!" People here voice their experiences and opinions as well as ask questions and don't always see eye-to-eye. I think that's a huge difference between an RSE type of group and an EMF-like forum. My opinion, for what it's worth."

Yeah, and that's possibly one of the bigger lessons we have all come away from RSE understanding. They talk about "social consciousness". Well, there is absolutely "RSE groupthink consciousness", narrowly defined.

I remember a woman ...after JZR was on a tirade about this n that... TELLING US what we "shoulda, coulda, woulda" in various situations, who turned to me and yelled in my face, "Whatever Ramtha tells me to do, I march !"

Holy crap. Get me outta there. I just stared at her, totally creeped out. I remained silent, wondering if she'd drink the kook-aid (not a typo).

Thank goodness we don't have to raise our hands and all agree in unison ! There is room for not seeing eye-to-eye, as we've seen over the past year.

What there isn't room for, sad to say, but nevertheless true, is for posters bullying the moderators. Getting private emails threatening us, or calling us names like junior high school, because "so and so didn't say the right thing, and we're going to kick and scream until you spank them on our behalf", isn't going to move us. We've sort-of-joked about posting some of the private emails we've gotten along that line. No identifying information, of course. It might be the funniest part of the forum if it weren't so sad.

It's amazing that people claim they want the freedom to speak THEIR minds, but when others do the same, well, then, that's another story.

Our rules are fairly simple and totally in line with every other forum we've seen...no flames. Be respectful. Doesn't mean you respect a person or an issue - but we can each BE respectful, especially given it's a SUPPORT and information forum. When people are looking for support after leaving a cult, they're not likely going to be at their personal strongest. They're betrayed, to say the least.

Hmm...maybe we need a category for "venting"? Keep Out unless you don't mind Hot Coals !? LOL, sort of.

Also, as has been mentioned already on another thread - never assume this forum isn't being monitored by "others"...and I don't mean RSE.

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