Wayne Allen Geis Acting Cult

Wonderful on the outside Treacherous on the inside....! Cults have millions of members around the world who also thought they were immune.
understanding
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Wayne Allen Geis Acting Cult

Unread post by understanding » Tue Feb 26, 2008 7:17 pm

Hello, I have been reading a lot here lately and finally decided to post. I hope you guys can help me or offer some guidance.

I belong to a group of people, that includes ex-students of the Wayne Allen Geis Cult, family members of those in and out of the group. Our goal is to destroy the Wayne Allen Geis cult forever.

Wayne Allen Geis is a former member of RSE. Please read the remarks of Cult Information Specialist Joe Szimhart on the Wayne Allen Geis cult here: http://home.dejazzd.com/jszimhart/wayne_allen_geis.htm

We are searching for information on Geis. Is anybody here that knew Geis during his time at the RSE? Geis and his wife Ruth Beverly Martin got accused of raping a minor while devotees of Ramtha. Geis and Martin confessed to raping a minor to an audience of about 800 Ramtha members. Is there anybody here that actually heard Geis and Martin confess? Is there anybody here that actually knew Geis or Martin?

Geis is in Woodridge New Jersey and PeEll, Washington. He moves back and forth. He has students that are living with him, under one roof with his wife and four minor children. He also has members that live alone in different states, nevertheless very devoted to Geis. All support Geis financially. Some satisfy Geis' need for perverted sex. Some that are under his spell help him deal with issues like Taxes, medical issues, travel arrangements and much more.

The prosecutor of the rape case in Washington said that Geis is subverting the Ramtha teachings for his own selfish purpose.

I've watched a lot of video's on youTube of JZK and listened to sessions of Geis he had with his "students". The similarities are perplex. Geis is using the same slogans and catchwords as JZK. The difference between them two, I guess, is that Geis is more sex obsessed as JZK? Geis needs to humiliate and control to get his fix, and JZK needs complete devotion and money from her devotees to get her fix?

I've read so much on mind control, I understand why people of all walks of life get hooked with such "gurus", but isn't there that little bit of light left in them, that actually no one can take away? That flicker of light needs to be nourished with enough oxygen so they see the "whole" picture. How can you provide that oxygen if they don't want to notice that light in them, they know it's there, I am sure of that, they just don't want to recognize it.

Sorry this post got so long.

Thanks for reading!

FreeNow
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Unread post by FreeNow » Wed Feb 27, 2008 4:57 am

Here is a blog that might help:

http://wayneallengeiscult.blogspot.com/
Keep the greater good at heart.

joe sz
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Unread post by joe sz » Wed Feb 27, 2008 9:47 am

:?: Our goal is to destroy the Wayne Allen Geis cult forever????? :roll:

The post above mentioned my name and website page re Geis 'process'. http://home.dejazzd.com/jszimhart/wayne_allen_geis.htm

My intention has nothing to do with destroying "the Wayne Allen...cult". My intention is not to do harm but to awaken those that Geis is harming so they can find the will to leave the creep.

understanding
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Unread post by understanding » Wed Feb 27, 2008 11:16 pm

Sorry I did not mean to come across as aggressive or violent. :oops:

Our intention is to help those in the process to live a life out of the process. We want to STOP the Wayne Allen Geis cult.

Whatchamacallit
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Unread post by Whatchamacallit » Thu Feb 28, 2008 6:19 am

Hi Understanding. Glad to see that you decided to post. Perhaps you'll get the responses that you're looking for, toward your goal. You'll also be likely to help others, too, in the process.

I don't think your post came across as aggressive - just that there may have been some clarity needed about who's connected to what. No harm, no foul !

I recall that incident, when "Ramtha" called Geis up to the stage. I don't recall any details, though. Just the situation being addressed, and it was very much in the forefront of "issues" going on in the "school" at that time. I probably have notes written about it. As I recall, it was discussed at several events.

understanding
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Unread post by understanding » Sat Mar 08, 2008 7:48 pm

@ Whatchamacallit or anybody else that knows:

Do you recall if Geis had an entourage of people inside Ramtha linked to him? When he left Ramtha (because whether he was asked to leave or decided on his own), did he have people that left with him, besides Ruth Beverly Martin? (this info is to be found on the net)

I was told that Geis had ?worked? in the Musical Department at Ramtha. So he was hired as a ?teacher? there? Did he work his mind control on those devoted to Ramtha for his own selfish purpose? And if he did, do you think JZ Knight ?taught? Geis how it?s properly done, was she the teacher?s teacher?
Does JZ have her ?teachers? follow her footsteps because she can?t control all of them at the same time? Is she creating little Ramtha Mini-Me?s that have to report on the end of the day?

When you say it was discussed at more ?events?. What exactly was discussed? Do you recall?

One of Geis ?followers? killed himself. His name was Wolfgang. He followed Geis from Germany to Washington after being introduced to the Ramtha teachings in Germany by Geis. Ex-students told us that Geis manipulated Wolfgang into suicide. Geis is referring to it often in his ?sessions?. Geis claims he could not help him, that Wolfgang was too sick (Geis diagnosed him, and that poor soul believed he was sick and incurable).


Thanks for your interest and help in that matter.

Whatchamacallit
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Unread post by Whatchamacallit » Sat Mar 08, 2008 10:46 pm

Understanding,

I'm going to ask around, to some friends, and see what I can come up with for answers to your questions.

I can only respond directly to what you wrote in this way:

The Ramster community is fairly tight. I think it's fair to say that most/many/if not all of the Ramsters hang on tightly to whatever JZ and/or "Ramtha" have to say. Word spreads like wildfire, which is why the word can go out on the street that the big kahuna has called an 'important' spontaneous event the same evening, and the students will come (and pay).

Whenever there has been an issue over the years, it's well discussed in private circles, as well as whispered about over restaurant meals, running into fellow Ramsters at the library, postoffice, local hangouts, etc. There are no secrets and much of the time, the non-student locals also know "the latest at the ranch".

The reason that I mention this, is to give you some background of understanding toward my answer to your question about the Geis situation being discussed during events, on the stage by JZ/R. When there is a drama, if you will, brewing within the community, and the Ramsters are all abuzz, there is a need to do damage control, and get the students on the straight and narrow. This is my opinion about why, when issues are addressed From The Stage, situations are discussed, defined, and students are told what to do.

This happened with Dr. Joe, Wayne Geis, Audrey-Grandmother, and other situations over the years. In that way, I recall that the Geis situation was discussed and then revisited for a window of time, until things simmered down.

That's the pattern there.

As for the detailed questions that you asked, I was out of that loop, but I will ask. I know a few people that I have in mind, are likely to have more answers. Give me (and them) a little time to get back to you.

Best ... Whatcha

ex
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Unread post by ex » Sat Mar 08, 2008 11:22 pm

i was on the event when geis and his wife were called on stage.
a girl wrote a letter to jzr to let her now that the geises had sex with her.
[keep in mind that i was a total brainwashed ramster in this time.
i didn't know any of the background]jzr pointed out that the girl is not on the event because of him.jzr stated how discusted she is that he uses the teachings in his voiceedjucation to take advantage of her.after the direct question if he had sex with the minor geis and his wife admitted that she had oral sex with her and geis watched.jzr thretend both that they go to jail for this.
[ i was very proud of my hyrophant ]jzr throw both of them out.one guy stood up and left.not for geis his argumentation was more that he critisised jzr for taking side in this story.[not being a good above human polarity] but this guy was later in the camaraderie circle from jzr.one of my red flags came with this story.since jzr predicted jailtime for them and they never got convicted for their abuse i started doubting the big guy.geises lawyer labeled the video as a religious confession and it wasent allowed in court.
jzr couldn't testifie because she had to hold up her channeling story.
as i heard the girl dident want to be called as witness because of her understandable trauma.
so this guy got away.there were another mother standing up when this case got mentioned on an event.must be the same story.
geis argument was that the sexual development is deep connected to the singing voice and thats the reason why they take care of this by having sex and make their students openminded and uninhibited.to the time i was there his acting and singing lessons were his bread and butter job and had nothing to do with the ranch other than sharing and beeing customers of jzr.

Whatchamacallit
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Unread post by Whatchamacallit » Sun Mar 09, 2008 12:18 am

Yes, I can vouch for what ex just posted as being true. I recall that incident as the major one when the issue was addressed.

Whatchamacallit
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Unread post by Whatchamacallit » Wed Mar 12, 2008 5:01 am

http://pub43.bravenet.com/forum/3633497066/show/622953

Understanding, please go to this link above and follow the information that has been documented already. There is another link with more info, also. It's about the topic of Wayne Geis.

Hope that it helps you.

understanding
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Wayne Allen Geis

Unread post by understanding » Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:11 am

Thanks for the links, they are very helpful. :-)

I like to read about people's opinions that actually met Geis and his wife.

What EX posted was very interesting, somebody actually being there while Geis was put on the spot, even if only by a woman that claims to channel a 35.000 year old warrior. I want to believe that JZK was so enraged by the letter, that she felt she had to ridicule (is that the right word?) Geis for what he did. I don't believe in the warrior Ramtha, I believe JZK is a sick woman that needs help. (I mean that in the nicest possible way)

I would like to communicate with the girl that wrote the letter. I want her to know that we are trying to stop people to join the Process. We care and want to help. Over the years many parents have tried to stop Geis from brainwashing his ?students?, mostly parents of ?devotees?. They all gave up; either when their children returned home or they had no more strength left.
As long as Geis is out there doing what he?s doing I will devote my entire free time into educating people about his Process.
I wish his children the vision to see clear and the strength to walk away.

Maybe the laws in the US need to be ?updated? or changed or even created new. Cults are everywhere, and the US government needs to recognize them and act upon them. People can believe in whatever they want that?s freedom, but if people get hurt in any way; this is where the government needs to step in. Maybe leaders/guru?s of such cults have to undergo a mental evaluation before they can preach/teach or something like that. Nowadays they can find out if one is mentally sick or not.
I was searching ?youtube? the other day for JZK videos and found a guy named Alan Steinfeld interviewing Dennis Kucinich http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CM6MARF7sK0. I am not sure, but I think this Alan Steinfeld is a Ramster or a supporter of RSE? And this Kucinich guy is major strange seeing UFO?s while holding a speech. But if guys like that make it into running for President in the US, I really wonder.

Whatchamacallit
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Unread post by Whatchamacallit » Thu Mar 13, 2008 12:31 am

understanding,

you made me laugh so hard with your comments !

YOU ...understand...

"As long as Geis is out there doing what he?s doing I will devote my entire free time into educating people about his Process.
I wish his children the vision to see clear and the strength to walk away.

Maybe the laws in the US need to be ?updated? or changed or even created new. Cults are everywhere, and the US government needs to recognize them and act upon them. People can believe in whatever they want that?s freedom, but if people get hurt in any way; this is where the government needs to step in. Maybe leaders/guru?s of such cults have to undergo a mental evaluation before they can preach/teach or something like that. Nowadays they can find out if one is mentally sick or not.
"

Yes, exactly. I totally agree that the laws need to be changed and updated to enforce accountability to ANYONE, whether they are the guru of the cult, or other similar position where there is abuse of authority. ESPECIALLY the guru. We have certification and licensure processes for all sorts of fields of endeavor in our society. Yet, these guru-types have no regulation, and they ought to. As you said, NOT to regulate WHAT they believe; that's their business. But when they start to harm others, it's not okay. There should be checks and balances put into place with regard to that.

understanding
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The Laws

Unread post by understanding » Sun Mar 16, 2008 9:24 pm

I am glad I made you laugh. My grandma used to say "A day without a laugh, is like a day not lived."

I was researching the laws a little on cults:
I found this website: http://bernie.cncfamily.com/sc/fbi_report.htm

In order for the police/FBI or whatever to act upon such a group, they have to evaluate the group first.
They are using Risk Factors, Neutral Factors and Protective Factors.

Risks are if the leader is known as violent, or buys weapons or using prophecies ect (Ramtha?)
Neutral are adopting unfamiliar customs (Hair growing ect.) or segregating themselfs from outsiders. (Hare Krishnas?)
Protective is when they start to get bureaucratic to routines their affairs. (like the Mormons ?)

So, I wonder how they (FBI) evaluate? Do they interview members and ex-members? Do they investigate the leader?
Somebody has to bring this to their attention? or are there FBI officers that search the internet, and read cult information forums and such?

understanding
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webpage

Unread post by understanding » Sat Mar 22, 2008 10:36 pm


Whatchamacallit
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Good work !

Unread post by Whatchamacallit » Sun Mar 23, 2008 3:02 am

The website is great ! May it help many !

understanding
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Kendra

Unread post by understanding » Tue Mar 25, 2008 4:34 pm

Thanks, I am still working on it. I am thankful for any testimonials or other info one might have.

If there is a Kendra reading along, we are looking to get in contact with you. Please email us. Thanks!

understanding
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testimonials

Unread post by understanding » Wed Jul 02, 2008 8:25 pm

The website is helping a lot of people.
Lots of People sent in their testimonials, most are too graphic to put on the website and I don't want to censor them, but some I can list.

A lot of people were hurt in The Process. Many families are still suffering. The trace of tragedy Geis left behind him in all those years is horrific. Those people did not realize they were brainwashed until they got out of The Process. Geis kept telling them that every church, group and belief could be a cultic setting. They never questioned the cult part.

When they got out they saw clear what was going on.... Geis had sex with most of his students, although asking them to astain from sexual relations.

All the cult information I read so far, is perfectly comparable to what Geis does. He is a textbook brainwasher....

I wish young children are informed, already at an early age in school or by their parents or other institutions, about manipulative abusive groups and cults in gerneral. So they NEVER get drawn into something so horrible. This is such a neglegted issue.

It will bite us in the ass if we don't educate our children on this.

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littlewiseone
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Unread post by littlewiseone » Wed Jul 02, 2008 9:20 pm

understanding - I agree this is an issue that needs to be addressed at a young age and studied in depth as maturity allows. Having a kindergarden-aged daughter, I struggle with how to age-appropriately introduce the subject... if anyone has any tips, I'd love some advice.
...and in the end, the love you take is equal to the love you make...

- The Beatles

Tree
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Unread post by Tree » Thu Jul 03, 2008 1:55 am

Geezuz.
what would you teach a teenager who is prone to peer pressure?

Is there a "cults for Dummies" out there somewhere?

Great question littlewiseone.

Tree
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Unread post by Tree » Thu Jul 03, 2008 1:58 am

and speaking of educating people about cults,
just when I think RSE is the last bastion of cults, I find out there are many more even MORE DANGEROUS cults out there.
Involving guns, drugs, jogging cults (joggers jogging until their death), the list goes on.
check out ICSA : http://www.icsahome.com/

understanding
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education

Unread post by understanding » Thu Jul 03, 2008 7:18 am

The ICSA Website is just great, I also love the Rick Ross website (http://www.rickross.com/) it has the newest news on cults and groups that are forming as we type.... so to say. The information on these websites is just enormous and so helpful when you want to understand and learn.

Maybe having an ex-cult member or ICSA spokesperson come to a high school class in prone areas before they graduate, to educate them about cults can be helpful. Like an ex-drug addict or ex-alcoholic talking about their experiences........ I don't know what?s best, but I believe somebody smarter then me can come up with something if asked to do something.
I have added many helpful links to my website in the link section.

Can anyone tell me about Alice Miller? Her books are being used in The Process to make the cult members realize what parents do is always wrong. Early on in the Process is when Geis gets them to start blaming the parents for their own problems.
That is how Geis initially gets them away from family and friends. Alice Miller's books makes you hate your parents.... it is so generally written that it can be applied to anyone that reads it. Someone with problems will find fault in their parents by reading her books. Stop blaming yourself, but blame the parents..... That is the message I get.....

Even when I read her book I started to question my mother, grandmother, just about anybody that raised me..... I am not denying that some have an abusive upbringing and go through a lot during growing up. But us "normal" parents, or those with "normal" parents that try to do the best we/they can, in the best interest of the child, get put down and accused of emotionally abusing our kids. Vacations, cars, money, clothes ect. mean nothing (but if that would be not existent there would be emotional hardship again), love and nurturing your child into adulthood is what counts. Yeah.....looking back, I know that my parents tried their best, I felt unloved at times (who doesn't?) was mad because she ignored me and went to work instead of playing with me (!)?.?.my mom is not a psychiatrist; she did the best she can. I will not blame her for my problems. I think love for others is helping in that matter. I love my parents, grandparents, with that love I have in me, I can forgive and understand.

Wayne Allen teaches that there is no Love for others, it is not healthy to love another human being you only love yourself!!!!!! (at the same time he has them reading A. Miller?s books) that must be so mind boggling. I can understand why they are being drawn to them, he feeds their ego, and his at the same time??. Then he has sex with them to share the self love?! This is a mandatory therapeutic act in The Process?.. ?I love myself to you???. Does that sound crazy? Yeah?.., but we pathetic ?normal? society people will think that this is pathetic and morally wrong when a mentor sleeps with his student for the act of self love?. In The Process it is perfectly normal and healthy to engage is sexual relations with each other. Boy with Girl, and Boy with Boy and Girl with Girl. In order to be healed you have to go against common morals?..they have sex because of the self-love, not to show love to another human being?.

Did I already mention that there are 4 underage children living in that home? Did I already mention that they are being brought up with Alice Miller?s books?

I can not put one and one together to get a clear picture of what these kids are thinking, learning, experiencing, dreaming and feeling......

joe sz
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Unread post by joe sz » Fri Jul 04, 2008 9:43 am

re alice miller, this review from amazon.com of "Gifted Child" is a good one, I think:

"227 of 236 people found the following review helpful:
Who am I, really?, December 19, 2000
By Boris Bangemann "boyse" (Singapore) - See all my reviews


When I read this book (which was originally published in German in 1979) for the first time in the early eighties, it completely swept me off my feet. Here was an analysis that explained why I was in search of my 'true self', why I felt my achievements were 'empty', why I felt empathy for others and antipathy for myself. The idea proposed by Alice Miller, in a nutshell, was that there are children who are able to feel and ease the emotional insecurity of their mothers (the 'gift' of the title), thus gain her love but in the process deny their own desires. These children grow up to become helpers in various roles, including therapists - like Alice Miller herself. They develop sensors for the subconscious signals of the needs of others. The problem is, they subconsciously deny themselves the pursuit of their own needs, and consequently cannot become who they 'are'. Which makes them prone to the illnesses which, according to the Freudian theory, go with suppressed desires - depression and grandiosity (the latter being just a way of keeping depression at bay).
Alice Miller's ideas are based on her experiences as a psychotherapist who practiced for 20 years, and her own self-analysis. Her reasoning draws on some basic Freudian ideas: if the subconscious is brought to consciousness, the illnesses caused by the suppression can eventually be contained; the life of a person is rooted in her childhood and childhood experiences shape who a person 'is'. In the last part of her book she adds a theory derived from her work experience: when children whose needs have been denied in their childhood grow up and have children of their own, they can 'get rid' of their pain by inflicting the pain on their own children. She calls it the vicious circle of disdain, and the handing down of destructive attitudes from one generation to the next like a chain reaction.

How do I see 'The Drama of the Gifted Child' almost 20 years after reading it for the first time? I continue to be convinced that the general argument is true. Alice Miller captures very well the emotional consequences of denying one's own desires in the service of a person whose love is so overpoweringly important that it demands the sacrifice of one's 'true' self. Hermann Hesse's life and works provide her with excellent examples to illustrate this, by the way. On some cornerstones of her argument, however, I have my doubts now. Firstly, the idea of a 'true self', chiseled in stone if you so want, does not sit very well with me any more. Secondly, her thesis completely omits the role of fathers (quite un-Freudian, by the way), and what I saw as a refreshingly new point of view 20 years ago, looks like a major shortcoming to me now. Thirdly, having read up on some developmental psychology, I do not believe any longer that early experience inexorably shapes our lives. Finally, I think humans are so complex that there can not be a simple mechanism such as a handing down of certain attitudes: there are just too many exceptions from the rule.

'The Drama of the Gifted Child' is a powerful book and it is worth reading even after 20 years. It is not a scientific book in the sense that it contains testable findings, it presents a practitioner's conclusions gained from personal experience. You may call it an informed speculation, or an interim report from 'the search for the true self' as it is subtitled."


As for why Geis or anyone else who lives through malignant narcissim finds Miller's book useful, it is a way to legitimize selfish needs to feel important. Of course, only the naive and manipulated would think that Gies truly understands Miller's intent.

Geis and JZ live in a world apart insulated from peer review and reality testing by grandiosity. Miller earned her reputation among peers in the field of mental health professionals. I agree with the reviewer above. Miller's powerfully written book can easily mislead the self-diagnosing reader.

I presented a paper at the recent ICSA conference in Philadelphia on a panel with Dr Sharon K Farber who wrote When the Body Is the Target: Self-Harm, Pain, and Traumatic Attachments.
http://www.amazon.com/When-Body-Target- ... 936&sr=8-1

She was able to expand her research into why some former cult members use self harm [emotional, physical, substance abuse] to deal with the abuse of time, identity, intellect, finances, health and integrity while in the group.

Talks like Dr Farber's got me thinking about the plight of someone like JZ who was admittedly severely abused as a kid. Interesting to note that now her personality is completely invaded and overridden by a capricious, possesive male entity that she in her subconscious created and recreates. The rebel god-complex costume has trapped her for life, it seems, and it would trap anyone else that believes it is real.

Marie
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Unread post by Marie » Fri Jul 04, 2008 3:51 pm

Talks like Dr Farber's got me thinking about the plight of someone like JZ who was admittedly severely abused as a kid. Interesting to note that now her personality is completely invaded and overridden by a capricious, possesive male entity that she in her subconscious created and recreates.
It fits with the "what we fear, we become" in order to over come theories..... and how children identify with parents, etc.. in order to survive... and that we unconsciously seek out and play out unresolved family of origin issues in order to resolve them.... JZ has become her abuser[s].

Lost in Space
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Unread post by Lost in Space » Fri Jul 04, 2008 11:27 pm

I kind of saw myself in the book by Alice Miller - painful, a bit, to see yourself described - but, on the other hand, I must disagree with some of her findings as too general - for example, my siblings had the same parents, but they do not have the same problems (perhaps you might say we all have problems, "symptoms", syndromes or whatever, but theirs are different from mine)...but I am a little confused as to how her book ties in with Wayne Allan Geis??? or JZK??? How did Mr. Geis use the book to justify his sexual excesses with young students? And, are we to take it that JZ is in the role of mother to her students?

Lost in Space
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Unread post by Lost in Space » Fri Jul 04, 2008 11:35 pm

Disclaimer to my last comments
...however, I have not carried over a pattern of hurting my child, or anyone else, as Dr. Farber suggests - I meant the part about trying to meet others' needs at the expense of your own, the self denial thing...

understanding
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Geis & Alice Miller

Unread post by understanding » Sat Jul 05, 2008 8:49 am

It seems like everybody sees themselves in her books. It is written so general (IMO), if you are looking to blame someone for your own problems, you will for sure find fault in your parents according to Miller. Geis makes all his students read her books, and then alienates them from their past life (Parents, family members and friends). The implication Geis is making is that when they go back to their old life, they will lose their gains (gain are: grandiosity (being a genius). They will be one again of the pathetic masses. Geis brainwashes them to believe that he is their savior, he can cure them of the ?illness? their parents are responsible for, and Geis diagnosed them with. Wayne Allen Geis? favorite saying is ?Dance and Spit on your parent?s grave?!

He tells each member ?You Will Die Without Me?! He inserts phobias in his students, and he is using Alice Miller?s books to make his statements stronger.
I wrote to Alice Miller once requesting support/help/answers in this matter, I wanted to see what she has to say about it, that a guru is using her words to initially draw people into his web of lies, she replied with one sentence: ?WHY ARE YOU WRITING TO ME?! After researching her a little more I found a forum link on her website, where people can write about their traumatic childhood experiences. This forum suggests that it is ?not for telling others that their childhood pain needs to be forgiven because the opposite is true?.

In my opinion you have to be able to forgive or put traumatic experiences behind you in order to be ?healthy and happy?. Holding a grudge all your life against your parents is making you bitter and unhappy and the injustice that was done to you can eat you up inside and the pain and anger can ruin your entire life. Forgiveness is something rather hard to do, I agree. But eventually it will make your life easier?. I don?t know what?s right and wrong. Alice Miller FOR SURE is more experienced then most in this subject. But in my humble opinion it is wrong to blame and hurt others instead of understanding and helping yourself and others. Well, there is the Love again. The Love for yourself AND others that is so important. And Wayne Allen Geis teaching is: ONLY LOVE YOURSELF? loving others is unhealthy?... A survivor of incest or other traumatic childhood experiences have every right to not forgive and forget. But they have to find a way to live with it, and when they eventually do, they can live a somewhat angry-free life.
IMO Alice Miller?s books help those that were inflicted by those unspeakable traumatic experiences.

Geis is analyzing every little detail from their childhood with his students. A, let?s say, ?insignificant incident?, like having to go to bed without dinner as a ?punishment?, that happened when you were 7 years old, and you just happen to remember that and told Geis in one of your sessions, because you felt injustice that night for the first time, because it was not your fault that the neighbors window was busted, but the kid across the street did it and you got blamed?thing??? Geis blows this out of proportion and makes this big deal out of it. Where was your ?enlightened witness? then? Who was helping you while lying in bed crying? Nobody, hey but I am here to help you now. I, Wayne Geis will help you, you have to surrender completely to me??? and then you will be healed and a grand person??

Sorry my posts are always so long?.. I am having a hard time explaining myself in just a few words?..:-)

understanding
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Unread post by understanding » Sat Jul 05, 2008 2:13 pm

... does JZ recommend Books to her followers? Does Ramtha talk about his childhood? Does he acknowledge JZ's abusive childhood?

Another Dimension60
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Unread post by Another Dimension60 » Sat Jul 05, 2008 3:03 pm

From the perspective of "life as a learning experience" - based on my personal life experience, I see "patterns"/issues that repeat themselves in my life until I find a way to respond/be in a centered mutually(myself and "Other") loving way. It's clearer and clearer to me that my Parents didn't cause my "problems", they were simply the first to present the "patterns" - Which is not to say abuse isn't abuse, or that abuse isn't wrong or hurtful/damaging ---- Nor is it to say that we are to blame or to hold responsible the victim for the abuse ---- There are simultaneous "realities"/dimensions/perspectives from which to perceive. In our 3 dimensional "reality" abuse is wrong and the victim is not to blame. From another dimension/reality perspective - perhaps simply the 4th/from the heart - seeing that our Parents enacted a drama for us through which to learn makes it easier to forgive and love. .... I know that when my Mother died I had a clear knowing/sense/experience of her dropping the costume of her Abusive/Controller Bitch role (just a clue as to my Mother's 3 dimensional role - each of her 3 daughters were psychiatrically hospitalized at least once, and one daughter twice). ... To me, Ramtha/JZ was another replay of my pattern of schizoid God/Human Loving/Hateful Being by whom I was abusively manipulated. For me it came down finally to choosing "God Within" or the "god" with out. It didn't end the pattern playing in my life -- I believe it's a spiraling process of "getting it" -- Awakening out of JZs world certainly was a major step ... and I'm still on the road to learning not to be 'at effect' of abusive control freaks.

Lost in Space
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Unread post by Lost in Space » Tue Jul 08, 2008 4:46 am

I was not acutally abused by my parents, who meant well but were themselves recovering from various traumas...always felt that they did the best they could...I was abused by people other than my parents. And, I see them not as vicous monster perpetrators, but as victims themselves, who lashed out somewhat randomly...I do not lead an angry life...anger is, to my mind, a waste of energy.
What I related to was that, in order to feel worthy, I have grown up as someone who defines myself in terms of how I meet others' needs, a "martyr" sort, and I have had to learn to put myself first sometimes - as, if I have nothing for myself, no love or self worth for myself, I cannot give to others... As a young women, I probably struck others as easy prey...I had to get tougher, and learn to set boundaries.

AnotherDimension60, your mother sounds like a lot of "pushy broads" I've met, and your story is not uncommon...it's a shame that our society does not educate us on how to be adequate parents!! It's a learn as you go process, parenting. And some people who had kids in the "olden days" did so because it was the done thing, and then, once they had the kids, had no idea what to do with them - OR were for whatever reasons not emotionally equipped to deal with kids, and had no concept of the impact their actions could have on their kids!

joe sz
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Unread post by joe sz » Fri Jul 11, 2008 10:49 am

I invite anyone involved with Geis and 'the process' and thinking of leaving his 'school' to contact me. Confidentiality promised.
jszimhart@dejazzd.com

Also, a great book to better understand the effects of childhood abuse and trauma on the brain is
"The Boy Who Was Raised As a Dog: What Traumatized Children Can Teach Us About Loss, Love, and Healing" by Dr Bruce Perry with Maia Szalavitz. Well-written, highly readable.
Dr Perry treated the Branch Davidian/Waco kids in 1993+.

http://www.amazon.com/Boy-Who-Raised-Ps ... 665&sr=8-1

Whatchamacallit
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Updated on 11/6/08

Unread post by Whatchamacallit » Thu Nov 13, 2008 7:45 am

This info was recently updated about the Geis cult, so I wanted to add it here at this time:

http://www.wayneallenprocess.com/

truster
Posts: 91
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to understanding

Unread post by truster » Thu Nov 13, 2008 8:48 pm

hi understanding
if his abuse has been destroying to you and others dear to you, then in turn destroy back unto him.
if someones elses personal view doesn't feel his organization should be destroyed, that is thier view, not yours.
know yourself, and act forward with your own feelings, not other peoples knowingness.
informing people to prevent futher abuse is good, and to put an ultimate STOP to it happening futher by closing his doors for good involves 2 motives for you than so it is.
truster

ex
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Unread post by ex » Fri Nov 14, 2008 3:39 am

by the way jzr remote viewd after the confession jail for geis and his companion......

understanding
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Destroy or not destroy...

Unread post by understanding » Fri Nov 14, 2008 11:36 am

When I said I want to destroy Wayne Allen Geis' cult, I meant to STOP it. I sometimes have problems finding the right adjectives, and use the first one that comes to mind.

Well, I am not destroyed, neither are others. There is always hope. And if I would be destroyed, I would not have the energy anymore to fight for freedom of the mind. So I am going strong actually... and I will be going until Wayne Allen Geis is finished. (ok, finished is not the right word either, I am open for sugeestions....) After we crossed the finish line, I will continue the fight for others, because mind manipulation will always be in our lifes.
I realized, that there are not enough "helpers" out there that spread the word. With every word you post online, with every conversation you have, you will inform somebody. Information is good, and they in turn will inform others. I wish I could explain Mind Manipulation/Cults/Abusive Leaders and the freedom of the mind in 5 sentences.

My solution to this problem:
Got to team up a cult information expert with a Linguist. Find a great charismatic loved-by-everyone Superstar (NO, not Tom Cruise....) (I am thinking OBAMA) and teach the Superstar the lines the Linguist came up with, and ...here we go.... it will go around the world in a day....and everybody is informed and UNDERSTANDS. Then we only deal with what is left in groups around the globe and give it two generations and we are FREE :-)

understanding
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Unread post by understanding » Fri Nov 14, 2008 4:21 pm

When I said I want to destroy Wayne Allen Geis' cult, I meant to STOP it. I sometimes have problems finding the right ENGLISH adjectives, and use the first one that comes to mind.
of course verbs and adjectives. :oops:

joe sz
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Re: Wayne Allen Geis Acting Cult

Unread post by joe sz » Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:49 pm

update: new website link to essay on Geis acting cult

http://jszimhart.com/theater_cult

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