courageous memoir by Kate B

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joe sz
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courageous memoir by Kate B

Unread post by joe sz » Mon May 07, 2012 3:18 pm

this 'transgender' person Kate B finally revealed s/he was in Scientology in new memoir and on national tv. despite her fame, took her 20 years to get over fear of speaking out about Scientology!
A Queer and Pleasant Danger: Kate Bornstein, Trans Scientology Survivor
The iconic "gender outlaw" on escaping the Church of Scientology and talking transgender rights on MSNBC.
Mother Jones

By Nicole Pasulka

Sat May. 5, 2012

"I identify as neither male nor female. . . . I'm neither straight nor gay," wrote transgender performer and author Kate Bornstein in her seminal 1994 book
Gender Outlaw
. Born in 1948 on the Jersey Shore to a loving mother and a dad who was "a macho, macho man," Bornstein left theater school in Massachusetts at the age of 22 on a spiritual journey that culminated in a 12-year stint in the Church of Scientology's Sea Org, an elite group of members who were based on ships and functioned like a religious order. Bornstein was excommunicated from the Church in 1982 and branded a "subversive person." In exile she's found her voice as a liberated, post-op, transsexual lesbian icon—though, of course, Bornstein bucks labels like these every chance she gets.

What the lengthy title of Bornstein's new memoir, A Queer and Pleasant Danger: The True Story of a Nice Jewish Boy who Joins the Church of Scientology and Leaves Twelve Years Later to Become the Lovely Lady She Is Today (on sale May 1, 2012) doesn't reveal is how scared she's been to talk about her time in the Church, until now. Thanks to the TV show "South Park," which satirized Scientology for mainstream audiences, and the hope that this story might someday reach Bornstein's daughter, who's still a member of the Church, she's overcome her fear of retribution. Today, Bornstein says pretty much whatever she pleases about sex, gender, and Scientology—with fearless humor and a "fuck of a lot of love."

Mother Jones:
I've followed your work for years, but I didn't realize you spent 12 years in the Church of Scientology. You were even on the Sea Org ship with L. Ron Hubbard! Have others been surprised, too?

Kate Bornstein:
Yeah. There are Easter eggs in every book I've ever written. I think in the first one I called [Scientology] "Diabology," but I was scared, so I didn't tell many people what it really meant.

MJ:
So you were on a spiritual journey in the 1970s and came across the Colorado chapter of Scientology. Why were you attracted to it?

KB:
Growing up we were secular Jews, but what I got out of Judaism at that time in my life was questions. Everything was a question. "Dad, is there a heaven? Is there a hell?" You never could get an answer. That informed a lot of my reasons for getting into Scientology, because they had all the answers. They said I was not my body, not my mind. I don't have
a
soul, I am an immortal soul. I've lived many lives and I'll live endlessly into the future, and as an immortal soul I have no gender.

Now this is a big deal, because I never wanted to be a boy, and I didn't want to grow up to be a man.

MJ:
Do you think the desire to transcend gender is an attraction for other people in Scientology?

KB:
I don't know. You know, I know two other trans people who were in Scientology, and that's not a question I've actually had a chance to talk to them about, but that's a great question.

MJ:
It's my understanding that when you publish something critical of the Church of Scientology, they can come at you with a lot of legal force. You said you were scared to write about them before, what changed?

KB:
I think it comes down to "South Park." "South Park" blew the lid off of talking about Scientology. All they really did was tell the truth. Once that happened, more and more people started to talk about it. I finally got to the point where it was more important to me to reach out to my daughter than it was for me to protect myself from any divine retribution from the Church of Scientology. But I think in their estimation I'm too much of a freak to be believed anyway. (
We contacted the Church of Scientology for comment, but did not receive a response
.)

MJ:
So writing and performing about being trans and about your sexuality has immunized you somehow?

KB:
I sure hope so. They call apostates "suppressive persons" and they believe one of my characteristics as a suppressive person is that I always lie with the aim of destroying humanity. I am like Dr. Evil personified, only a tranny, and everything I say to you could very well be a lie.

When you're a Scientologist it's like the movie
Goodfellas
, where the gangsters hang out with only other gangsters. We only hung out with each other, so we knew we were saving the world. There was no question. And we knew anyone who was in our way was suppressive and needed to be shattered. Those are their words: shattered.

MJ:
That sounds pretty brutal.

KB:
I was diagnosed with PTSD, and I had night terrors for about 15 to 20 years after I left. This is when you know you're dreaming and you can't wake up. Those stopped after I started writing this book. It got down to nightmares, and now they're just bad dreams, so speaking about it has been helping.

MJ:
When something is haunting you, does it help to write about it?

KB:
Having experienced totalitarian rule for 12 years in Scientology, it was good to write. So, yeah, I'm a lot calmer about my trans stuff now.

MJ:
In the book, you write that your superiors within the Scientology world had always been aware that you were struggling with your gender identity in some way.

KB:
L. Ron Hubbard personally knew about that. He was personally in charge of making me feel better, I found out. They thought I could be cured.

MJ:
And then did they use it to turn others against you after you left?

KB:
That's the big paradox. They don't believe that thetans, immortal souls, have a gender, but they're really homophobic and transphobic. If you're a pervert like me, that's a symptom of being a suppressive person. You must be a suppressive person, too.

MJ:
Undoubtedly, I'm a suppressive person. Outside of Scientology, are queer people going mainstream? You wrote
Gender Outlaw
in 1994, and last month you were on MSNBC on the Melissa Harris-Perry show talking about transgender rights. How have things changed in the past 18 years?

KB:
They have changed, but they haven't quite mainstreamed yet. We're at the point now where, finally, with that one-hour segment, trans people and the media hit a fucking milestone. It was mainstream coverage of trans issues that didn't focus on the individual narrative. The "Oh, what was it like for you when you grew up?" story. I'm all for the individual narrative, but unless it's really in service to the cessation of suffering, what the fuck use is it other than being a freak show? So people from the freak show got to an issue-based movement with that one hour of television.

MJ:
Right, because you were talking about experiences of trans people in prison, voting rights for trans people, and trans activism. Melissa Harris-Perry defined "cisgender" on TV!

KB:
Is that awesome or what?!

MJ:
One thing that struck me about your appearance on that show is that you spoke about gender as being more than just male and female. I feel a lot of people, even trans activists, don't define gender that way, or don’t agree with that idea.

KB:
It’s not a very popular thing. Not all trans people agree with this non-binary thing. There are some who do and there are some who don't. I don't speak for all transsexuals or all transgender people. Certainly I honor anybody who wants to be a man and do the work of becoming a man. I honor anyone who mindfully becomes a woman. That's cool. But, I really don't get how there's only two choices. There's no two of anything else in the entire universe; why should there only be two genders? I don't get it.

MJ:
Yeah, you talk about the dozens and dozens of letters that could follow LGBT.

KB:
I did a web search, I found over 750 distinct sex and gender identities before I stopped. You can find them in 20 minutes. Across cultures. Across race. Across age. There's all kinds of lesbians, there's all kinds of dykes, and dykes aren't necessarily lesbians, but they sometimes are. And as soon as you include people whose identities are based in gender, then all of the sudden you have to include feminists and we have to include sex workers and pornographers and porn stars.

MJ:
How is all this multiplicity and fluidity manifested in your life and work?

KB:
I play with images of myself—every trans person does. When we were talking about the design of the book, I had images of different places in my journey from birth, to boy, to man, to baby dyke, to glam, and they wanted that on the spine of the book, and they wanted pictures in the book. I was like, "You know what? No." That's what every trans book has had—before and after pictures. Let's not do that. It wasn't just about, "I am a woman trapped in a man's body."

MJ:
Maybe because your path was to something beyond the binary.

KB:
Listen, the power of that narrative, the before, the agony, the masculinity, the during, and then the after—that's what got me through the night. That's all that was available when I was growing up. So I would read that over and over and over again. But this book is for my daughter, and my grandkids, and I wanted them to see more than that one facet of me. That's what I wanted to get across. People's voices can't be silenced now. I'm a member of a Twitter "Twibe" of over 12,000 people (@KateBornstein). I've got almost as many Twitter followers as the Church of Scientology (@Scientology). Somebody made the point that the internet is Scientology's Waterloo. They don't know what to do about it. That gave me a lot of courage.
Nicole Pasulka is the social media intern at Mother Jones. For more of her stories, click here. Follow her on Twitter

http://www.motherjones.com/media/2012/0 ... -interview

Kensho
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Re: courageous memoir by Kate B

Unread post by Kensho » Tue May 08, 2012 3:40 am

QUOTE: "They said I was not my body... I am an immortal soul. I've lived many lives and I'll live endlessly into the future, and as an immortal soul I have no gender.

Surprise, surprise. :shock:
This is verbatum what the Ramtha character, JZ, as well as the 'appointed teachers' have said many times.
I wonder if the Scientologists could nail Judith for theft of cult dogma? :-)

With love, Kensho
"Don't let any person bring you so low as to hate them."
Booker T. Washington

Rooster
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Re: courageous memoir by Kate B

Unread post by Rooster » Tue May 08, 2012 6:58 am

Very true Kensho,
I love she came out for her daughter. True power and love is a mother protecting her family!

Kelku
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Re: courageous memoir by Kate B

Unread post by Kelku » Tue May 08, 2012 9:54 am

Respect to Kate for her braveness.

We received these teachings about being without gender for years just as another tool to increase confusion about ourselves.
Honestly I never really understood the whole issue when she talked about crossovers etc..
Asking others, including the teachers, the answers were vague... obviously too complicated to get a straight answer so everybody made up her/his own little explanation ;-)

In a meeting with staff some years ago the Ramtha-character administered to all the women in the room for hours claiming that we're all crossovers. :shock:
Pretty sure, I was not the only woman leaving this session confused about herself.
Back then I checked it off as not really being important whether I am a crossover or whatever but in hindsight I can see that it only added to the continous maceration of ones own self-perception.
“Rather fail with honor than succeed by fraud.”
- Sophocles

joe sz
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Re: courageous memoir by Kate B

Unread post by joe sz » Tue May 08, 2012 3:59 pm

re the no gender thing
keep in mind that Scientology claims that Buddhism is closest to what they teach, then keep in mind that Blavatsky and Olcott, the Theosophical Soc. founders, took 'pansila' or 5 vows to become Buddhists at end of their careers. Of course, Buddhism in Theosophy is a hybrid teaching blending Rosicrucianism, Sant Mat, and western occult traditions into their dharma blender. Hubbard was greatly influenced by the early 20th cent occult movements that included channeling and by Aleister Crowley who also channeled. Hubbard 'channeled' the infamous OT3 [Operating Thetan 3] secret teaching about disembodied souls being brought to earth [Tigiac?] by an Alien overlord Xenu [aka Xemu] and being disbursed into volcanoes then blown up with atom bombs causing BTs or Body Thetans to attach themselves to all newborn humans that Scientology auditing can help to eliminate or "Clear." ...I know, I just said a mouthful if you are not familiar with the OT3 myth. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenu

What I am saying is that many new sects incl Ramtha tap similar sources for their information, primarily the Gnosticism in Theosophy. This explains the similarity. The whole space brother thing appeared after WW2 with the emergence of flying saucer tales over Roswell and other places, the appearance of E. von Danikan's 'Chariots of the Gods' (1968).

The idea that we are genderless in the spiritual state is nothing new. The Hindu idea of Atman is similar. Even Jesus is said to have said 'we will be like the angels that neither marry nor are given in marriage.'

The idea of a sexless "Thetan" [soul] in scientology is a ripoff of the occult concept of Monad in Theosophy--I learned this Monad idea when in CUT.
This is Theosophy's convoluted, mind-numbing teaching through C W Leadbeater re Monad:
http://www.anandgholap.net/Monad-CWL.htm

preeatenna
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Re: courageous memoir by Kate B

Unread post by preeatenna » Wed May 09, 2012 2:21 am

JZRambles has stated on several occasions that I have heard, that the Mormons are closest to his/her teachings. S/he also claims to be the angel that gave the teachings to Joseph Smith, and s/he also taught Jesus Christ and was one of Joan of Arc's voices, and started the ancient mystery schools. There are a lot of other claims similar to this. I can't remember them all off hand.

ex
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Re: courageous memoir by Kate B

Unread post by ex » Thu May 10, 2012 4:34 am

JZRambles has stated on several occasions that I have heard, that the Mormons are closest to his/her teachings.
can anyone confirm this? . she might talked about the food storage ?

i heard that jz was joan and rambels beeing jessus creator.

Kelku
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Re: courageous memoir by Kate B

Unread post by Kelku » Thu May 10, 2012 5:58 am

Personally I don't recall the 'being closest to the mormons', at least not as a recurring reference.

I remember JZR making jokes about their polygamy and claiming that the school is close to gnosis and gnostic teachings.

As for her own incarnations, it seemed, she remained intentionally vague, especially when it came to famous historical figures like Joan d'Arc, Mary/Mary Magdalene and Elisabeth I ....
There were lively discussions after such remarks, "Did he really say JZ was Mary....?" and interpretations went wild and varied a lot.
“Rather fail with honor than succeed by fraud.”
- Sophocles

freemysoul
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Re: courageous memoir by Kate B

Unread post by freemysoul » Thu May 10, 2012 6:16 am

I remember at least 3 people that JZ claimed were reincarnated from the Dalai Lama, and at least two who she claimed were William Wallace. She would get so drunk she couldn't remember who she gave what title, or when for that matter. It just goes to show you, JZ Knight is fully aware of hooking people into her dog and pony show by making them feel special, or different than the rest, the whole while preaching about being humble and selfless. What a load of horseshit.

joe sz
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Re: courageous memoir by Kate B

Unread post by joe sz » Fri May 11, 2012 5:42 am

mentioned this a long time ago on emf
in her 2nd fanciful autobioagraphical tome, Shirley MacLaine, reported that in the early 1980s when she was a "student" of Ramtha, she would pay $1000 per half-hour for personal sessions with JZ as R and R would offer red wine which they would drink together till drunk. Shirley said that "Ramtha" would be sloppy drunk by end of session but
"JZ would wake up with the hangover." :lol:
http://www.amazon.com/Dancing-Light-Shi ... 055376196X

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