to the rse watchdogs

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ex
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Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2008 9:18 am

to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by ex » Thu Jan 27, 2011 3:45 am

to the rse students who has to watch out on emf. how can you bear it knowing both sides of the coin. jz with her stage show and the public appearance of rse about you r concerned about. do you have only contact with other rse students who share and agree with every rahm philosophie? are you enthusiastic newcomers who have hopes to get into the favored circle around jz to fill up the voids others left by dieing or leaving or just falling out of jzs favour. are you old students who don't wanna move on? if you r the later do you just ignore the discrepantses between legal inc.side and the teachings of rse. never got any doubts if ramtha is real and jz plays it all. do you fear the time when you r not current anymore and rse aboundens you into their statistics and dont know you anymore? wouldn't you make changes without rse? would your life stand still? r you allowed to answer this? or r only hit and run allowed? of course if it is too
embarrassing don't answer. what i actually expect. feel free to proof me wrong.

NewGuy
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2011 6:54 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by NewGuy » Sun May 01, 2011 11:39 pm

Greetings to Ex

Ok, Ex, I will reply…ramblings from my personal point of view.

I do find many of RSE teachings to be interesting, challenging, and thought-provoking.
I do find many of EMF postings to be interesting, challenging, and thought-provoking.
And yes, I am playing both sides of the discussion. . It is my attempt to learn from both viewpoints. I tend to be a ‘moderate’ and not bounce from one extreme to another. It’s my process and it works for me---just trying to keep an open mind.

I am not emotionally, spiritually and or financially committed in either direction. I do not plan to move to Yelm, live in an UG and abandon my family and beliefs. At the same time, if I can grow and develop from a RSE Teaching, I will do that.

My summary of previous posts:
“I am not here to defend or criticize---just provide another perspective.”
“I have now attended 3 events.”
“I did learn and that was my goal.”
“I was there for me, my personal growth/development and to apply “some” of the teachings to my daily life. Yes, I did pick and choose.”
“No, I do not do daily disciplines.”
“…my overall experience has been worthwhile. I may or may not attend again.”.

“Life is a learning process and I will heed your warnings.”

EMF Website: Lots of great info and I have done hours of reading and learning.
RSE: Lots of great info and I have done hours of reading and learning.


The Mind Trap - (Great article; well written, insightful. Similar traps that are found in Religion. Has made me reflect on my own religious beliefs. Imho)
Getting Stuck in the Snare “This is the insidious phase. For many people, this phase is sneaky. You learn bits of information, and it all seems to start out so well ! Then, over time, with additional information, one's paradigm of reality is shifted.”
Final thought/question: Somewhere, in a previous post, there had been mention of JZ vomiting and or spitting on the students. Would someone be able to direct me to that video?

Grateful for the openness and freedom of debate that your website offers.

Respectfully

The NewGuy

Ockham
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Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 6:15 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by Ockham » Mon May 02, 2011 3:17 am

Hi New Guy and Ex,

I'll agree that some of the disciplines taught at RSE may be helpful in getting one's life together, though I'm not so sure C&E would be my cup of tea.

It is the disingenous boat load of, "The Days To Come (tm)," hogwash that comes along for the ride that is too much for me. JZ/R have been predicting hideous disasters for 20+ years and none of it has come to pass. One certainly could cherry pick from the RSE teachings and decide some of the disciplines and some of the messages will help you get your life to where you want your life to be. A tip of my hat to you if you can cherry pick successfully and not get tripped up in the doomsday scenario.

Have you noticed that a lot of RSE teachings feature stories that have been on History Channel in the last few months before the teaching? A specific one that comes to mind is one that was in a recent super primary, part of which was made available as an Internet streaming video. A ramster friend of mine described the seemingly amazing reincarnation story of, "James 3," from the Soul Survivor book and History Channel video. If you dig around on Google a little, you can see that James' story has some holes, most significantly is that James does not correctly rmember the type of plane in which James Jr. was shot down near Iwo Jima. No fighter pilot would get that fact wrong. Were I running a school of enlightenment, I would have fact checked such a story that I featured. Would Ramtha suggest to feature Soul Survivor?

As a non-student, I am limited to books, recordings and videos from RSE that are available to the public. Obviously, I can't have personally have experienced a wine ceremony, but I have friends that have been there, and in short, the behaviors allegedly exhibited by JZ/R and the attendees are way short of enlightened. JZ/R and the studends getting drunk to the point where they vomit all over the area is enlightened in what way? If you watch the mideast solidarity video posted on Youtube, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbleQv1e0-8 you can see that JZ as Ramtha is intoxicated. It doesn't stop with alcohol abuse. RSE has also promoted mis-use of Prozac and encouraged students to obtain Prozac through questionable means. You can read about it in a lengthy article here: http://www.fourwinds10.com/siterun_data ... 080100.PDF

Next come the scams promoted by RSE. Hundreds of RSE students lost probably millions of dollars in a phony bank debenture scam called Omega Investments that JZ openly promoted. http://www.quatloos.com/cm-omega/fo-omega.htm The usual: If the promise sounds too good to be true, then it is too good to be true applied to this in spades. Ramtha didn't see that one coming. Also, Sea-11 water: utter non-scientific, non-quantum, nonsense. Water alkalyzer machines: worthless at best.

If you like Ramtha's message you may find that some of the roots are in HP Blavatsky's and later Vera Stanley Alder's writings. You may find that the Theosophical Society in America may be your cup of tea. It will at least be a much ligther on your wallet than RSE: http://www.theosophical.org/

Best wishes to you.

ex
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Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2008 9:18 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by ex » Mon May 02, 2011 3:21 am

hi new guy. you see this post is written after the event in southafrica an d even greg simons interview were he lies about rse and its intenions and the teachings. i know from my own expierience that even ramtha tunes down when there r foreign students in the requierds or beginner held. i stated in some earlier posts that the smartest thing i would do nowadays: fly in for a beginner and leave my attendence at that. why schould i start at the beginning again if i wanna do advanced courses a year later? at one point there was the line reached for me were the things i had to overlook outweighed my learning: a lieing ramtha, a ramtha with postmenaposel problems, rude staff, bulling and arrogance among students, failing predictions,scams, multilevel marketing. i liked the self responsibility but i hated the babysitting despite of this. little personal variations in the disciplines got me in trouble. i had experiences in the tank which showed the manipulation which went on there. jzr is not the only source for knowledge despite whats said at rse. give me one or two specific things you learned there which you can't learn some were else? i also stated before that for some rich folks, were money is not a issue, hold out a long time there. its their church. read the posts about the leagel issues rse definitely backs off every responsibility for the appearance in public. good for you if you get through without brainwash and harm to your familie and friends. when i left rse i was very disoriented and i would have appreciated a side like this. being not alone leaving that behind.

ex
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Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2008 9:18 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by ex » Mon May 02, 2011 3:37 am

a other thing this was adressed to rse staff who read this board. people who work for rse and know it from other aspects. i appreciated your input so. i realy would like to know what a greg simons would say if he cant lie and manipulate. but thats his privacie and non of this peorsons will ever give me an answer to this questions. which shows me how weak theire stand is. greg stated that rse is not a doomsday cult. that was januar now jzr sinks japan and send the ocean to hunt her " enemies down?" together with aliens ?????

Ockham
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Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 6:15 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by Ockham » Mon May 02, 2011 3:47 am

Well put Ex, thanks very much for your insight.

For the rearchitecting your life aspect of RSE, there are probably plenty of good books in a public library that offer advice at least as useful as what Ramtha says. Just ask the librarian to see self help books, and you'll probably get everything you need cost free. The difference is that you'll have to read the books yourself.

There is one Ramtha audio tape that a ramster friend palyed for me, you'll have to forgive me that I don't know the title, where JZ/R is giving relationship advice to students. I feel sorry for anybody that followed the very wrong-headed advice on the tape. It seemed to me like it was JZ emoting Ramtha rather than channeling Ramtha, and JZ was really re-experiencing and projecting her prior marriages and possibly an abusive childhood. That wasn't the stuff what what healthy personal relationships should be.

freemysoul
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Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by freemysoul » Mon May 02, 2011 4:23 am

As far as the spitting and vomiting on stage, you just will have to take my word that I have witnessed it first hand, both the blowing and spitting of snot, and the vomiting. What importance this has, I am not quite sure, because the words JZ vomits and spits out are by far more toxic and potentially hazardous than any mucus or vomit she emits. JZ spits and blows snot, and pushes her chest out as all part of her act. If she is portending to be an 8 foot tall conqueror of two thirds of the known world, what better, more masculine thing to do then spit and blow your nose out onto the stage, it definitely adds to the show.
I have gotten to a point in my own recovery from RSE that I rarely even use the name Ramtha, instead I prefer to direct my point of view at JZ Knight, for it is she who is pulling this sham and it is she who is continuing to frighten and manipulate people as we speak. Unless I absolutely have to mention her alter ego, for the sake of making a point, I will make JZ Knight the target of all my comments and statements. You can't hold a non existent figment of JZ's imagination accountable for her actions, and what better way for people to move on with their lives than to get over the idea that there ever was a 'ramtha'.

appealing
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Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by appealing » Mon May 02, 2011 9:59 am

I have gotten to a point in my own recovery from RSE that I rarely even use the name Ramtha, instead I prefer to direct my point of view at JZ Knight, for it is she who is pulling this sham and it is she who is continuing to frighten and manipulate people as we speak. Unless I absolutely have to mention her alter ego, for the sake of making a point, I will make JZ Knight the target of all my comments and statements. You can't hold a non existent figment of JZ's imagination accountable for her actions, and what better way for people to move on with their lives than to get over the idea that there ever was a 'ramtha'.
I feel exactly the same. And there are perfectly good words that I no longer feel comfortable using because they have become so affiliated with JZ, and I can't bear to hear them coming out of my own mouth!

Appealing

Another Dimension60
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Re:a buffet

Unread post by Another Dimension60 » Mon May 02, 2011 1:44 pm

Previously on this message board someone used the metaphor of a restaurant serving tainted food to describe RSE. In a similar vein - JZK Inc is like a buffet which presents itself as providing unique foods based on original/ancient recipes - except all the food served is brought in from elsewhere - so all the head chef needs to do is arrange it in a appealing manner while adding the slow acting addictive poison to each diverse dish. ... And as also mentioned in the previous metaphor, some consumers may not be as effected by the poisons as others. ... ... Nevertheless, every dollar spent at this deceptive buffet is a contribution to the rape and murder of others. There's no question that the food is appealing in presentation and appearance, even in taste; there's no question that it is filling and often satisfying, to some. Nevertheless, it is poisoned.

Often people compare the pre RSE ramtha to the post RSE ramtha to the ramtha of the present - often making claims that here was the 'real' ramtha but not now..... My experience with jzk inc began in 1984 and has continued in one form or another to the present. Again there is no question that the material presented prior to 1989 is 180 degrees different from the present 'teachings' --- What is consistent from the very beginning is the subtle manipulation of people - there are recognizable and repeated patterns of what is ultimately abuse, and at the least conscious manipulation of people's hearts minds and souls. .... .... An equally valid explanation of the difference between ramtha of the 80s and ramtha of 2010 is the classical deterioration of ego driven cult leaders. (for those of you who have heard of mafu, penny torres has had a similar deterioration - i.e. substance abuse, verbal and physical violence, sexual pre-occupation; the leader of Heaven's Gate was wacko by the time his followers killed themselves).....

Even a simple yet significant thing as ramtha's accent is a 'tell' of consistency -- for example - my first 'experience' of ramtha was via an audio tape from around -84/85 - with the classic ramtha British/India accent and stilted language. In 86 (I think), the accent was just plain ole New Mexican.... then somewhere it shifted back to the British thing - and now in a single event it can change from moment to moment. .... An even sillier 'tell' - since the beginning days of ramtha in the late '70s, he's still surprised at 'what you call' christmas present wrappings -still learning the english language and the contemporary world -- if it takes an ascended enlightened being 30 years to figure out a "Safeway", how smart is he afterall? :lol:

Although the NewGuy appears to see both sides = rse and emf -- there's worlds of difference between the two - rse presents to lure, fool, use, ensare and enslave - for a fee. EMF presents to heal and liberate and support independence and self trust - for nothing.

Sadly New Guy reminds me of the young me smoking her first cigarette certain she could stop any time; and tragically of the young woman who goes on the 'jenny crank' diet believing she can stop anytime....
Blessings to you NewGuy - bottom line, you're eating poison - perhaps your constitution is such that it won't adversely effect you ---- except that it already has since you haven't yet recognized the scam that is perpetuated by jzk inc.

NewGuy
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Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by NewGuy » Tue May 03, 2011 11:34 pm

Thank you for your thoughtful replies. For me, there is a lot to learn from both sides. As I said in an earlier post, “…my overall experience has been worthwhile. I may or may not attend again.” “…just trying to keep an open mind.” “I do not plan to move to Yelm, live in an UG and abandon my family and beliefs.”

My events with RSE have been limited and so maybe I am being naïve in saying that I can keep both sides of the debate in balance. However, from my own experience, I believe that the beginning retreat was an educational experience and an opportunity for personal growth (the ‘hook’; maybe, don’t know??)

After reading so many of your posts, I am starting to question my ‘open mind’ position. The cautions that I hear loud and clear are mostly in regards to your experiences with the advanced classes and Blue College. Some have written about the various wine ceremonies, staring/adoration of JZ, blind obedience and no discussion/questions of the RSE topics. If those are the teachings of the advanced classes, I would not be able to accept them and I would be concerned if I had a loved one involved.

(btw… enjoyed your posts about ‘card reading/mapping’ and learning the process that is used to master the discipline of the cards. Please share other experiences)

( from Another Dimension60 “Sadly New Guy reminds me of the young me smoking her first cigarette.” I had a good chuckle after reading that as I thought back at my first and only attempt to smoke at age 13. Took two puffs, threw-up, learned my lesson and never looked back…good analogy…thanks )

I will stop; as I seem to be rambling and searching for that middle ground—it’s got to be here somewhere…???

NG

Ockham
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Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by Ockham » Wed May 04, 2011 4:07 am

Hi New Guy,

Great segue at the end of your post; "middle ground."

First, thanks for your thoughtful posting. It makes me feel a little better to hear there is at least one person who nhas gotten positivity from RSE without sliding into the expensive quantum rabbit hole.

While I was reading your post I was thinking that I feel like I've had the opportunity to experience spiritual development taking classes from a Tibetan monk at a local new age learning center for price of a very modest love offering. If anything, I think the message was clearer because it wasn't muddied up with quantum pseudo science. The trademarked terms weren't there, but the techniques taught seem much like the descriptions of some RSE disciplines.

Re: middle ground, consider this quote:
The Middle Way or Middle Path (Pali: majjhimā paṭipadā; Sanskrit: madhyamā-pratipad; ) is the descriptive term that Siddhartha Guatama used to describe the character of the path he discovered that led to liberation. It was coined in the very first teaching that he delivered after his enlightenment. In this sutta - known in English as The Setting in Motion of the Wheel of Dharma - the Buddha describes the middle way as a path of moderation between the extremes of sensual indulgence and self-mortification. This, according to him, was the path of wisdom. The middle path does not mean a mid point in a straight line joining two extremes represented by points. The Middle Way is a dynamic teaching as shown by the traditional story that the Buddha realized the meaning of the Middle Way when he sat by a river and heard a lute player in a passing boat and understood that the lute string must be tuned neither too tight nor too loose to produce a harmonious sound.

In later Theravada texts as well as in Mahayana and Vajrayana Buddhism, the Middle Way refers to the concept, enunciated in the Canon, of direct knowledge that transcends seemingly antithetical claims about existence.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_way

Blessings to you.

Kensho
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Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by Kensho » Wed May 04, 2011 1:53 pm

QUOTE: "...but the techniques taught seem much like the descriptions of some RSE disciplines."

Although the methodology/practices may appear similar, it is the intention of a true spiritual path (equanimity, love, compassion, appreciation of impermanence), that is quite different than the one that is promoted by RSE (survival of the self at all costs, even to the detriment of others; for that self is perceived and promoted as the most imporatant thing in the universe).

With love, Kensho
"Don't let any person bring you so low as to hate them."
Booker T. Washington

ex
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Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2008 9:18 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by ex » Wed May 04, 2011 5:23 pm

so new guy since you tried to answer this thread are you a rse watchdog? there were people before here who claimed: we r here for the balance. we did well being in rse. later it was obviews that they were on staff at rse. again what specific do you like at rse? the aliens who spill the oil? the haarp people who sink japan to the ground? the cheere crowd? the philosophie of a guy who solved his problems with headchoping trying to make sense of a magical blue flame at your stove or safeway? bashing of other groups? the socialy accepted swearing spitting lieing drinking smoking? beeing so impartial makes me thinking.

Ockham
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Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by Ockham » Thu May 05, 2011 5:04 am

Well put Kensho. Spot on as usual. Techniques of focus and letting go seem similar, but the end result is a lot different. I was just having a discussion with a ramster friend and I could tell RSE teaching had seemed to have dampened compassion in that person. I find the message of RSE seems to encourage becoming self-absorbed and that seems to be at opposition to being compassionate and God-like.

Appreciation inpermenence is something that RSE apparently does not understand, given the UGs, Twinkies, etc. all concerned about life extension. About a year ago a grooup of monks visited our city and constructed an exquisite mandala only to remove the mandala as soon as it was complete. That was a great object lesson in appreciating life's journey for what it is, and to be willing to let go without fear or regret. In the public material of RSE, this in not a lesson you would receive.

Kensho
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Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by Kensho » Thu May 05, 2011 9:35 am

Exactly.
RSE claims that what you hold in your mind with effort creates the nature of your reality. There is the ultimate irony, because with all of the concentration on preserving the physical life above all else (survival, UGs etc), one would think that the RSE followers would clue in that if they truly believe the philosophy of RSE, that by engaging in base survival of the self as being of primary imporance, they may in fact be securing nothing more than life that is a fear and survival based physical existence. Nothing special there...it is the sorry lot shared by all animals.

Never mind not being god like, hoarding years worth of food and supplies, then hiding out with those provisions from others in the ground in a state of fear isn't even a life that expresses the qualities of animals which typically do not take more from their environment than they need. Even animals that store food do not do so beyond what is necessary from season to season.

The intelligence, spirituaity, higher awareness and discernment inherent to human beings is a long ways away from such a low mentality and may even be less than the state of mind of an animal (instinctual compassion for others does exist in the animal realm).
How tragic that the quest for something better may be leading some to follow RSE into a life that is not only lower than human, but lower than that of the lowest of animals. Even reptiles, insects and worms do not engage in this sort of behaviour; for compounded (self created imaginary story lines) and sustained fear does not exist at that level of low intelligence.

It breaks my heart to know that the potentiality of wonderful human lives are being diminished and wasted in such a way; all because of greed...it truly does.
May those so affected and afflicted find an easy path to be free of it.

With love, Kensho
"Don't let any person bring you so low as to hate them."
Booker T. Washington

Another Dimension60
Posts: 291
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Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by Another Dimension60 » Thu May 05, 2011 12:55 pm

There is more subtle 'layers' to the fear and self-focus -- There is the consistent and persistent duality perpetuated/manipulated by jz -- For example, the conscious intention of many jzk inc customers is in fact to prepare oneself to better serve others. .... Perhaps duality isn't as accurate as the image from an old yellow pages ad in the US - 'the grope' - a hand trying to go in several directions simultaneously. So there is the simultaneous sacrificing of one's life to serve others while serving oneself and sacrificing one's loved ones.
And there is the blindness to the fear and inherent contradictions. Egos cannot create reality - egos can manipulate materiality for sure, --- or, as an old scholar once said: one cannot will to will the will of God.....
It took someone else to point out to me how much fear we customers of jzk inc lived by - and I was only able to see/hear that after I had begun to doubt the validity of the jzk inc 'product'. So this self-blindness becomes another layer of the tragedy....

NewGuy
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Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2011 6:54 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by NewGuy » Thu May 05, 2011 9:55 pm

Hi, Ex Thursday evening

I won’t bite—just softly nibble on your bait.
Sorry to disappoint as I am not a RSE watchdog.
And, as for me? not a debater; just someone with lots of questions and no answers.

What’s the deal with the Safeway reference? I don’t understand…
Also, if anyone saw yesterday’s stream please enlighten me as to your thoughts and reactions.

Thanks for the reply.

NG

ex
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Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by ex » Fri May 06, 2011 10:28 am

sorry having accused you. i just wonder how people who heard false predictions, lies,know probably jzs lawyers talk. can go on in standing behind rse [thats kind of the lowest for me they must have lost their own self respect completely. i only know one reason: they get some crumps from the cake. jzr [= jz as her invented,scaming 2. personalty] sometimes playes the naive childlike worrier amazed about modern live. so what questions make you searching. there r some cleverer people here on the board than me. if you ask more specific, you might get an inspiring answer.

Another Dimension60
Posts: 291
Joined: Sun Jun 15, 2008 7:28 pm

Safeway and such

Unread post by Another Dimension60 » Fri May 06, 2011 12:19 pm

I think Vanilla stated in another post how ramtha asked staff what certain words meant -- maybe not --- nevertheless - over 30 years ramtha kept making the same statements of confusion or 'discovery' of a contemporary word, concept, or practice. A better example than Safeway(a grocery store chain) is wrapping on a present, particularly Christmas - pretending that the wrapping was so beautiful he didn't realize it wasn't the gift..... Certainly some other oldtimers remember this bs -- i first heard it in the mid-80s and he had the same response in the '90s --

Once again - although it is significant that jz's behavior has deteriorated into drunken rants, and that the 'teachings' are 180 degrees different after 1988, the essential patterns of manipulation and need for singular adoration are the very very very same. ... Perhaps the Jeff Knight video would be helpful - Jeff was with her through the 80's, through the transition to RSE -- and finally recognized that at least since the 80s jz 'used' the ramtha thing to lure and ensnare and keep Jeff....

Needless to say - most anyone could easily become a drunken psycho after 30+ years of pretending to be an Enlightened Ascended Heirophant - with no one you can openly confide in .... how utterly lonely and crazy making is that?

The very first tapes I heard of ramtha had validity for me because they seemed in line with the Edgar Cayce Readings -- Took me 15 years to realize that 'in line' was because of flat out plagiarism. Just this morning a quote from the Readings: "You only fail if you quit trying. " - sound familiar to anyone?

Some people have had unexplainable experiences re Ramtha and consider him real -- nevertheless, the manipulation and mind altering and flat out brain washing have been consistent from day 1.

Kensho
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Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by Kensho » Fri May 06, 2011 2:07 pm

And that strikes the vital point perfectly!
Thank you AD60 :-)

With love, Kensho
"Don't let any person bring you so low as to hate them."
Booker T. Washington

Ockham
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Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 6:15 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by Ockham » Sat May 07, 2011 11:37 am

Never mind the inellectual wrong-headedness of JZ/R's, "teachings," now I think the red flad that told me to distance from, "Ramtha," was the repeated inability of Ramtha to grasp the obvious. How could any being be hyper-enlightened and not be able to understand what a three year old child can figure out. I forget where I ran across it, but the "What be a Safeway [grocery store]?," quip is one that stuck with me. Even assuming Ramtha was being ironic is a stretch. Why didn't Ramtha just say, "Don't shop in a store; you need to grow your own food!" Teaching is about clarity of message, not speaking in goofy metaphor.

ex
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Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by ex » Sat May 07, 2011 6:14 pm

ramtha claims also to have watched us in our evolution. should have better kept up with technical and social development.

Ockham
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Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2011 6:15 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by Ockham » Sun May 08, 2011 3:48 am

I remembered where, "What be a Safeway," quote is from. JZ's book, A state of Mind: My Story 1987. She's talking about early days of Ramtha, saying he was following her around asking questions. My observation: to reaclimate after 35,000 years of being away. Perhaps reasonable, but as Rick Martin, points out in an article in the August 2000 issue of spectum, http://www.fourwinds10.com/siterun_data ... 080100.PDF, why then would Ramtha be so familar with secret inner workings of the government and, "Graymen," and not know about grocery stores.

You can read the quote in context. A state of Mind: My Story is on Google Books. This link should take you to the correct place in the text: http://books.google.com/books?id=ImuRDD ... 22&f=false

ex
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Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by ex » Sun May 08, 2011 5:27 am

the juice of the cow... is another one. if they had goat milk in the morning before the march , according to ramtha, they have the word milk in their vocabulary not an intellectual joke description.

Interested
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Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by Interested » Mon Nov 12, 2012 3:52 am

NewGuy wrote:Greetings to Ex

Ok, Ex, I will reply…ramblings from my personal point of view.

I do find many of RSE teachings to be interesting, challenging, and thought-provoking.
I do find many of EMF postings to be interesting, challenging, and thought-provoking.
And yes, I am playing both sides of the discussion. . It is my attempt to learn from both viewpoints. I tend to be a ‘moderate’ and not bounce from one extreme to another. It’s my process and it works for me---just trying to keep an open mind.

I am not emotionally, spiritually and or financially committed in either direction. I do not plan to move to Yelm, live in an UG and abandon my family and beliefs. At the same time, if I can grow and develop from a RSE Teaching, I will do that.

My summary of previous posts:
“I am not here to defend or criticize---just provide another perspective.”
“I have now attended 3 events.”
“I did learn and that was my goal.”
“I was there for me, my personal growth/development and to apply “some” of the teachings to my daily life. Yes, I did pick and choose.”
“No, I do not do daily disciplines.”
“…my overall experience has been worthwhile. I may or may not attend again.”.

“Life is a learning process and I will heed your warnings.”

EMF Website: Lots of great info and I have done hours of reading and learning.
RSE: Lots of great info and I have done hours of reading and learning.


The Mind Trap - (Great article; well written, insightful. Similar traps that are found in Religion. Has made me reflect on my own religious beliefs. Imho)
Getting Stuck in the Snare “This is the insidious phase. For many people, this phase is sneaky. You learn bits of information, and it all seems to start out so well ! Then, over time, with additional information, one's paradigm of reality is shifted.”
Final thought/question: Somewhere, in a previous post, there had been mention of JZ vomiting and or spitting on the students. Would someone be able to direct me to that video?

Grateful for the openness and freedom of debate that your website offers.

Respectfully

The NewGuy
this is my attitude. I really like EMF, but the Teachings from the 80's and 90's, coinciding with Eastern Thought continue to intrigue me. I am thankful that this messageboard has been created, as it is the only place in the virtual world, where anyone could ever really understand my perspective, may not agree, but understand and that is important for me, virtually, otherwise messageboards are a waste of time (for me).

Interested
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2012 5:08 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by Interested » Mon Nov 12, 2012 4:05 am

Ockham wrote:Well put Kensho. Spot on as usual. Techniques of focus and letting go seem similar, but the end result is a lot different. I was just having a discussion with a ramster friend and I could tell RSE teaching had seemed to have dampened compassion in that person. I find the message of RSE seems to encourage becoming self-absorbed and that seems to be at opposition to being compassionate and God-like.

Appreciation inpermenence is something that RSE apparently does not understand, given the UGs, Twinkies, etc. all concerned about life extension. About a year ago a grooup of monks visited our city and constructed an exquisite mandala only to remove the mandala as soon as it was complete. That was a great object lesson in appreciating life's journey for what it is, and to be willing to let go without fear or regret. In the public material of RSE, this in not a lesson you would receive.
What other techniques do you, that help One "let go". I am interested in learning some other ones, if you don't mind sharing Ockham.

Interested
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2012 5:08 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by Interested » Mon Nov 12, 2012 4:09 am

Kensho wrote:QUOTE: "...but the techniques taught seem much like the descriptions of some RSE disciplines."

Although the methodology/practices may appear similar, it is the intention of a true spiritual path (equanimity, love, compassion, appreciation of impermanence), that is quite different than the one that is promoted by RSE (survival of the self at all costs, even to the detriment of others; for that self is perceived and promoted as the most imporatant thing in the universe).

With love, Kensho
IMO, when I have listened to the old Ramtha tapes, I heard love, compassion, appreciation and change also and that, Survival was important to give you more time, to work on your Self, to go back to 'The Original Self'. It really does read just like Eastern Philosophy with a "The Ram" persona, but no real difference to all other Spiritual Thought.

Interested
Posts: 19
Joined: Sat Nov 10, 2012 5:08 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by Interested » Mon Nov 12, 2012 4:16 am

Yeah, I always assumed he could see pictures in your brain, so when you use the word 'Safeway' you would surely show him a picture of a supermarket and he would know exactly what you were talking about.

Some things like that, I find perplexing, too.

ex
Posts: 857
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2008 9:18 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by ex » Mon Nov 12, 2012 7:33 pm

well serios. i know i have a short temper and for shure i have not enough patience to argue with someone who defends a lier and crook. there is nothing wrong with learning but with my understanding of rse there is no learning there. there is a lot of manipulation and delusion going on. and you sound that you like to hold on to the 'delusion of rse' or at least cherrypick it. i assume you red the interview with steven weinberg [its here on emf]. he is a guy from the beginning. he claims that he co created ramtha in the white book for the new age. he also describes in the beginning there was something pure and great and than jz took over. that is long before the 2000 disappearance. i know you are exited if you made a few events and never heard jz loosing it on stage or believe all the fake testimonies. it will come a few 1000$ later. enjoy the good there. rse comes with a very high price for your spirituality and your well being. on emf is a lot were jz got her materials from and we went trough the buts already [ the 'i know you' someone stated here is just a 'we heard that before']. only you can make up your mind if you make it up according to jz that's your problem.

NewGuy
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2011 6:54 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by NewGuy » Mon Nov 12, 2012 11:55 pm

Hi, Ex

(I may have posted this reply twice. Been a while...forgot the process)

I have not posted in about 1.5 years; however, I do log into the EMF website a few times a month and have read many insightful posts. Thank you.

I have not been to a RSE Event in more than a year and half but I would be willing to go again to an 'Open House' Weekend Event.

Recently, I was sent the article from the local Yelm paper regarding the court order to halt the video postings. And so...out of curiosity, I took a look at a couple of the video posts.

I am 'playing' both sides of the fence here...Yes, some of the video was rather distasteful; however, at the same time an non-disclosure agreement had been signed. So...it will be interesting to follow the outcome.

Best Wishes

New Guy

ex
Posts: 857
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2008 9:18 am

Re: to the rse watchdogs

Unread post by ex » Tue Nov 13, 2012 5:26 am

sorry its not serious its for interested.
what does this mean?waiting who wins before you make up your mind? there are no teachings were a confidentiality applies. its like a bank manager caught on tape robing his bank and than claims privacy for the evidence. jzr claims to be a public figure as such she should behave as . david asked the school about the february event. the people didn't tell how it rely was according to rse they made satire. now we see it was much worse.

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