Children in RSE

Posters have cited (in our initial forum) instances of children being continually and repeatedly exposed to verbally abusive, vulgar language by "Ramtha", witnessing physical assault, hearing sexually explicit talks, etc. This forum is open for discussion and exchange of views.
Whatchamacallit
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Children in RSE

Unread post by Whatchamacallit »

Re: any thoughts for children in rse? Old EMF forum.
http://pub43.bravenet.com/forum/3633497066/show/599368
whatchamacallit

Jan 14, 2007 - 7:52AM

Re: any thoughts for children in rse?
maryann,

first of all, i wish you and hubby well with this challenge you face. i understand how hard it is. i also understand the brick wall you're talking about. if your stepson is in the "believing" stage of the teachings, it's a real hard thing to get through to someone at that time.

i think, just that you both disagree with him being in the school, is hard enough.

but, there are other things, perhaps that you have both heard about, that he has been exposed to there. one thing, is the episodes of "teachings" where "ramtha" is drunk, along with adult students, and the swearing that "he" does would stun many if not most adults. this has been ongoing for years now, and children are in the audience hearing this.

as a matter of fact, "ramtha" has had to address parents of children, because their children seemed to think it was alright to say, "f*** you" to anyone for anything, as long as they felt like it. my opinion, is that "ramtha" was inappropriate for using that teaching style in a mixed audience such as one including children. i also question if subjecting a child to that environment, especially repeatedly, is child abuse.

i could say more, but i think that i am making the basic point that it is, at least, questionable.

please feel free to email me if you would like to speak more about this topic, privately.

Email



maryann

Jan 14, 2007 - 7:59AM


Re: any thoughts for children in rse?


thank you all for responding. so much of what you're saying rings true. we do try and stay in touch as much as possible, but they live in yelm and we are no where close. lots of phone calls. yes, virginia, there is another point of view outside of ramtha's santa village and all of that. hopefully it will sink in eventually. but it's difficult for a child who's only known this lifestyle other than short visits to choose between a mom's life and dad's life. I'm not saying that some of the ideas aren't positive and valid. but as you all seem to say, the methodology seems to be more towards confusing the participants and making money than much else. I'm concerned for a child's psyche who spent several months in lock down awaiting the end of the world, who has/is participated in the wine/smoking ceremonies, who thinks - depending on the instructions of the month - that red meat, medicine, toothpaste, or fumes from airplanes will kill him, to the point of hysteria. and then of course, when the rules change, all is buried rather than admitting it doesn't make sense. yes, also showing symptoms of megolomania from being fawned over. we didn't realize that was a standard kissing baby thing. thank you for that insight.

our biggest problem is to get him to talk to us about it. there are no feelings - you're right. conversations tend to be about third party issues. not friends, feelings, thoughts. he shuts down and refuses to talk. and we don't want to push too far in fear of how fragile he is. we don't know how much he's been told to not talk to us about this or something bad will happen. how mentally brainwashed are these kids? if we knew what they were told to say and not to say, perhaps we could use it as a starting point. to my knowledge, he has yet to levitate - but they're so close .. .. if only they concentrated harder .. . . am I alone in thinking normal emotional development is stunted in these kids? he reacts emotionally more like a toddler than a rebelling prepubescent.

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maryann

Jan 14, 2007 - 8:03AM


Re: any thoughts for children in rse?


one interesting differing thought - the bad language has never been an issue with him. he doesn't use it and seems very uncomfortable when he occasionally hears it. it certainly doesn't seem to be a ramtha sanctioned behavior for him.

small mercies.

Email



whatchamacallit

Jan 14, 2007 - 8:40AM


Re: any thoughts for children in rse?


i think the emotional development is affected.

maryann, i suggest that you obtain a book titled, Getting Your Life Back by Janja Lilich.

it will be helpful and extremely insightful to you and hubby with your situation.

and yes, it's a probability that he is being told NOT to talk. my opinion is, it's about 99% probable. it's fairly common, actually. also put under the guise of "nobody will understand you because they don't understand the teachings, and you must keep pure. do not cast pearls before swine."

guess who the swine are ?

Email



maryann

Jan 14, 2007 - 9:00AM


Re: any thoughts for children in rse?


no problem with me being one of the swine - heck, I am the stepmom, after all. but I'm also the outsider coming in to a preexisting situation and potentially being able to see all sides a bit more clearly because of that.

and that's where I'm looking for a bit of validation for my approach. I think that avoiding the situation, and not attacking obvious falsehoods, discrepencies, whatever, only continues to give them validity. because we all know that the kid is being told that the outside world is swinefilled and evil. and if we don't argue, we have the old silence indicates agreement. however - it's a fine line. because, as I said before, we don't want his head to explode.

and I'm not convinced that a child raised by total zombies in this environment will ever develop a healthy sense of doubt. at least not in the foreseeable future.

so if I could start a conversation with something like, so, did you believe it when ramtha said/did ____________ fill in the blank for me with information, please, at the assay, or new years meeting or whatever, could lead to something that might stimulate independent thought in his head.

and please feel free, everyone, to give me some information to fill in the blank.

by the way - am I just a parent of a different generation or concepts of parenting, or do you all think it's normal for a 10 year old to be out partying in a field with ramtha on new years eve as opposed to home in bed??

Email



in_the_zone

Jan 14, 2007 - 9:49AM


Re: any thoughts for children in rse?


I was at Assay 6 in 2005 when the children were huddled at the door in gleefull anticipation of ramtha's arrival...and i will say after looking back on it...it was staged, in my opinion. I think those kids were not forced but prodded to be there by their guardians...plus, what kid doesn't love to be acknowledged with a big hug from the big kahuna. More scam, more organized deception, more BS.

Email



Christel Ricke

Jan 14, 2007 - 10:40AM


Re: any thoughts for children in rse?


Maryann, As it appears you are not the legal guardian of the child it appears to me that the influence you can have on it is minimal....unless the child decides for itself it has had enough.

I know someone who was going to attend a New Year's Event in 2005. The person changed her mind at the last minute and told me afterwards that the reports she heard from the event were that people were so drunk that people were throwing things and it was like a war zone. She was very glad she did not attend.



maryann

Jan 14, 2007 - 10:59AM


Re: any thoughts for children in rse?


we have shared guardianship, however, he is primarily in yelm. we get holidays, summers, etc, until/unless he chooses to live with us. which of course we hope for. as you said - legal battles are no ones' first choice. but if one parent says one thing, and the other says the opposite, it's still the child that is torn in half, regardless of joint custody.

Email



maryann

Jan 14, 2007 - 11:01AM


Re: any thoughts for children in rse?


one of the intriging things we heard about the new years eve bash was that it ended a little before 12 this year - seems ramtha's legal dept didn't want to be liable for drunks on the road -

Email



whatchamacallit

Jan 14, 2007 - 1:41PM


Re: any thoughts for children in rse?


i'm going to start a new thread for the drinking and driving issue.

Email



whatchamacallit

Jan 14, 2007 - 2:34PM


Re: any thoughts for children in rse?


maryann,

if you scroll up to the top of this webpage, you will see a link to FACTNet. There is a folder in FACTNet for RSE and it has actually been there for years as part of a larger website that covers forum boards for many coercive groups (and similar groups).

In any case, if you go to the site and read through some of those posts (many of them, so it will take some time), then you will find lots of topics that you can insert into the sentence you stated in your previous post. That should go a long way toward sparking conversation with stepson.
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David McCarthy
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Re: Children in RSE Insights Into The Fear of Speaking Up

Unread post by David McCarthy »

Pulled from our old EMF forum, posted by whatchamacallit
http://pub43.bravenet.com/forum/3633497066/show/601786

Jan 26, 2007

Re: Insights Into The Fear of Speaking Up

It's all a form of manipulation. If we accept the fearful emotions that we may have, we're going to limit ourselves because of it. I was in an audience of at least 1,000 people a little while back, and "Ramtha" threatened my wellbeing because I refused to raise my hand in compliance with a question that I did not agree with. I mean to say, he was ANGRY, and even scared those around me.
I stayed in my spot, and stared at him with no expression.
I refused to engage him. In my heart, I was losing respect for who I thought my teacher to be, acting like such an axxhole. Out of control with anger. It was such a blessing, in a strange way, as it helped push me out the door. I went to my RV and cried so hard for hours upon end until I thought I was going to be sick to my stomach.
The Egg Cracked that day. It was over, and the rest, until my last attended event, was just going through the motions of detachment on all levels, and observing the ... the blindness of most of the students. I would search/scan the audience as I sat there, for others who did not raise their hands. I was in the front and on the video camera, so perhaps that ****** her/him off even more. I don't know. I don't care anymore, either. I'm truly free.
I care enough about myself and have enough self worth to know that I did not deserve that outburst at all. I don't accept it and I never will. That being, whomever it truly was, was like a threatened, angry, egotistical child having just that - a temper tantrum. I learned something very powerful about myself that day - about my own inner strength.

It was then that I started quietly doing "google" searches on "ramtha", "fraud", "rse scam" and all similar things like that. I read for hours and hours and hours, for weeks and months. I had found FACTNet, and I read every post many times. I couldn't sleep at night. I thought about all of the things I had told my children about "Ramtha", that I assumed were true, and how they trusted ME (as young ones who believe their parents), and how I had to now undo all of that. ACK !!! It was like going through the stages of grief. Then I got angry...the betrayal...that so and so...how could JZ sleep at night or look herself in the mirror ? I thought about those wine ceremonies, when "he" was stinking drunk and used language that was worse than an X-rated movie, for up to 9 hours straight, in front of children. That is child abuse. Talking about extremely sexual/private/adult content for hours on end, also in front of children. That, too, is child abuse. It all made me nauseous.
Where could I turn to talk to someone ? Few people even knew I went to RSE.
Thank the real God that I found many articles, and then FACTNet...but the clincher was an article in Williamette Weekly.
I read the looong article. Then, I saw a photograph of this guy they interviewed and quoted as an x-RSE student, David McCarthy. I looked at the picture and I remembered him. Seeing him at the ranch many times. Never talked to him. Just remembered him very clearly. I screamed to my hubby, "I KNOW THIS GUY!"
For some reason, that was enough for me to start posting and emailing David. He has proven to be a very sensitive, caring, honest, compassionate human being. He has strength and bravery. He has tolerated verbal attacks and gossip because he has dared to speak out about RSE and demand accountability. But, he has spoken only facts as he has known them. He has asked hard questions and they have yet to be answered. I hope he sees the day, and we all do, that those answers are forthcoming.

I also wish that we would see the day that Audrey, and ex-staffers, would speak up.
JZ can't hurt anybody. She's a bully. That's my opinion, and I'm speaking it.
I have compassion for her, but I believe she is a child in an adult body.
Carolyn Myss describes the "wounded child" syndrome and it makes me think of JZ.
But he has nothing on at all, cried at last the whole people....
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