A Story of Grandpa and His Footlocker

For general chit chat on RSE related topics. You are walking through the woods and come upon a group socializing around the campfire. Pull over a log to sit on and join us. Introduce yourself here! Pages 1 & 2
truster
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A Story of Grandpa and His Footlocker

Unread post by truster »

Not actualy my grandpa but my cousins.
He had a footlocker in the attic of all his war memoribilia.
As a kid cowboys and indians, war movies, hogan heros were exciting.
My cousin and i allways wanted to look inside and asked him if we could.
He never allowed us to, nor did he ever look in there anymore himself.
He didn't recommend it for himself or others.
But why even keep that vibration in his house i wonderd for some time.
Now i have all these jzr books,tapes and dvds's agitating me as i walk past my bookshelf.
I think it is time to buy a footlocker and put all them in a box.
Never to sell them for the greed of the dollar, for why help to continue such a thing i don't approve for anyone.
Never to listen, watch,or read again.
But my own therapy of satifaction to imprsion such a terrible thing, as grandpa did himself.
Thank you grandpa for your ways.
Truster
California Dreamin'
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Unread post by California Dreamin' »

I have hundreds of RSE tapes stored in a big, long, coffin-shaped box under my bed. I keep waiting for a "signal" from somewhere to tell me what to do with them.

I have every tape from every event that I could purchase beginning in 1988. Like you, Truster, I can't quite seem to throw them away because of all of the $$$ invested, but if anyone wants them and can pay for the shipping, I'd be glad to donate them. Maybe a researcher or author is interested in them.

I'm serious here. What do I do with all of this stuff??????

Same for the books, too. It's amazing that even though the gig is up and the Emperor who has no Clothes has been revealed, I placed such value on all of this stuff that in some weird way I am still attached to it all.
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G2G
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Unread post by G2G »

*After* I left RSE, I actually sought out those sources and resources from days of old, ie, Blavatsky, Vera Alder, Cayce, Masters of the Far East, Love Yourself into Life, A Master's Reflection on the History of Humanity parts 1 and 2, Last Waltz of the Tyrants, the "original" White Book published in 1986, plus The Two Paths video, the breath videos, and more. I did this so I could compare the consistencies with the teachings of old, as well as the hypocrisy of jzrk's own teachings of today with her teachings of long ago!

I know there are a lot of family members reading here and posting here. I feel for those of you having family leaving/or gone to Yelm. But, for those of you who DO have family members who are "out" of RSE, take a moment and think. Does your family member express "rage" and "violence" toward jzrk? Or have they sought out counseling and feel more a sense of sorrow for the mess jzrk is in? Do they constantly discuss it with you? Or do they rarely mention it? Did they guide you to this sight? Or are you searching on your own? And if so, if your ex-RSE family member/members come here only rarely or are not in obvious "withdrawal," then why are some of you, who haven't been to RSE, feeling so much hate, particularly if your family member is at home, and rarely thinking of RSE? Are you perhaps thinking of RSE more than they are? Because you simply *cannot* know what they experienced for several reasons. First, each person might experience RSE differently, in their own manner. Some never return at all, calling it a bunch of hooey! Some go back, thinking they will learn more, then quickly see they're not learning anything new, or if they do, it's something as silly as a rolled up piece of paper called a "godscope." The other thing....would you really like to see the real deal, the real sessions that occur? Because it's not going to look as ugly as you think. You *have* to have *been* there. I can fully understand if you're family picked up and left and moved, for that is "indeed" tragic and I pray they shed their blindfolds and toss them into the mud, as I did. But why the anger from those who have family members who have left RSE, rarely discuss it (except perhaps to crack a joke), and you find yourself experiencing and discussing things about their "guilt" which perhaps they don't feel, their "punishing themselves" which perhaps they don't do, etc. If they've resolved the issue and no longer are there, then why is your anger so obvious? Do you think you might be pushing them away in that respect, because remember, if they are out and have had counseling, are not freaking out over various triggers, why, without your having been at RSE, do you feel they need assistance when/if they're continuing moving ahead and away, particularly if they are involved in other endeavours?

This is by no means intended to discourage family members. Because those of you who have family who left for Yelm, obviously lost a great deal. But there are also others who have ex RSE family members doing quite well, and then why would one wish to bring this all into their lives and feel a "hate" etc. which their own ex-RSE family member doesn't embrace at all, but might instead embrace sympathy for those who are lost...that they might find their way.

We also have to look at the sources and various belief systems of the posters here. Not everyone believes in the bible verbatim. Not everyone believes a lot of things verbatim. So when we say, "Jesus did this," are we quoting from a legitimate source? How do we know what was included and omitted? I won't even begin to discuss the ancient texts of other religions/belief systems.

For me, I only believe there is a "God/Supreme Essence/Singularity"....and that we are all a part of it, as it exists within. So I connect with this everyday. Since I left RSE, I went through many stages. But I never would propose any violence, for I'm a pacifist, and do "indeed" believe in "what comes around goes around." But that's me, and I believed that long before I ever came close to seeing, "What the Bleep does Judy know!"

This is a very special place, this "EMF." It is the *only* place of it's kind in existence. We need to maintain that we are "indeed" of sane mind, so as not to be simply dismissed as some here have dismissed the poor followers wearing the blinders...not realizing "critical thinking equals survival."

I'm not angry with jzrk, nor do I wish her harm. I'm simply happy to no longer be there, and it wasn't that long. Nor do I punish myself or feel guilt. I did learn to not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

The bottom line is, sometimes you just had to be there....to understand. And no, I wouldn't advise going to anyone. Just trust those who have exited and be happy they have, and should they require your assistance, I'm sure they all appreciate the wondrous gift you offer to them.

Peace out!
"I never really understood religion - it just seemed a good excuse to give" - Ten Years After circa 1972
Whatchamacallit
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Unread post by Whatchamacallit »

i'm skimming the posts...don't really have time to "chat" right now...but to g2g, i will say that "yes" there has, especially lately, been an expression of deep frustration, and anger, toward jz. i think it makes some readers feel unease (i don't like it), although...this, too, is a part of recovery of ex-students and affected family members. it's specifically addressed in my favorite book, (take back your life) and it's a reflection upon where a person is at in their recovery. that is N-O-T intended to sound judgemental in any way...it's a STAGE. it may last five minutes or a lifetime, who is to say ? just like current students may enter the "gates of hell" (rse) for one event or hundreds....or....a lifetime.

i can't begin to imagine what i would do if i had a teenager or young adult child in rse. i would declare war, for sure. i can see myself as one of those people engaging an "against the will" deprogramming. i can advise others to tread lightly, etc., etc., which my LOGICAL mind knows is the WISE thing to do...but i would want my kid outta there yesterday. i would surely be angry.

i think feeling so helpless toward the situation of having one's loved one trapped in there, being brainwashed, only adds to the anger.

recently, folks have said "just kidding". i believe they are "just kidding", but at a deeper root, we're witnessing the crying out of pain in their hearts. that, too, needs compassion.

i'm really just kind of "talking out loud" here because some of what you're referring to, i'm unsure of. we may not even be talking about the same thing; i'm referring to very recent posts, but they're not even on this thread.

anyway, i have to scoot for now. :)
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xindy
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Unread post by xindy »

G2G said:
"I'm not angry with jzrk, nor do I wish her harm. I'm simply happy to no longer be there, and it wasn't that long. Nor do I punish myself or feel guilt. I did learn to not throw the baby out with the bathwater.

The bottom line is, sometimes you just had to be there....to understand. And no, I wouldn't advise going to anyone. Just trust those who have exited and be happy they have, and should they require your assistance, I'm sure they all appreciate the wondrous gift you offer to them."
______________________
What you say is so honestly put. I tend to over react, due to my sensitive nature, & I'm assured my ex-RSE sister is functioning quite normally. I guess I should be praying for Mrs. Knight instead of projecting anger toward her. Since I've never been to RSE, (and don't have any desire to) I guess my imagination of what goes on at the ranch & seeing videos of the Ram in action & hearing stories of The Tank, Sea Water-11, etc. just add fuel to the fire.

Thank YOU for "Enlightening" me. :D
"I was CULTivated since my birth unintentionally by Parents following Catholicism."
truster
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RSE Material In A Box

Unread post by truster »

Yes i agree g2g what comes around goes around. And what jzr has put out speaking of the bad stuff will come around. there is no stopping that, one or many will and are responding to stop it.
In wresteling which has proven itself to be the best form of defense of all the martial arts. Ultimate fighting has proven this. In wresteling it is taught that any bad moves that come to you the first response is to stop it,then if bad force continues you counter the move for a takedown.
This is what police officers are trained and security personel are taught. it is called force continumm. you match the opposing force, otherly put instant karma.
for a few years i tried to live my life and allow karma to rule myself, to not fight any situation. I realized by a tibet example if you dont stop the bad it will take one over.
tibet's method has been proven not suitable to the world we live in. i'm not running away i'm stopping it!!!
i have allways liked the picture of a frog choking the stork's neck as the stork is trying to walk over the frogs life, with the message "never give up!!!"
a lot of people have spent thier hard earned money on her lies, and we want it back with millions of apologies from a class action lawsuit.

and california dreaming why would you keep something you dont aprove of under your place of sleep. put a label on that coffin "court documents to bankrupt rse archive" and move them to the garage where you keep the trash cans and let the stink permeate it. dont give them away this board may need such a complete collection to stop her, or counter for the takedown.
Truster
California Dreamin'
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Unread post by California Dreamin' »

Truster -

[quote]put a label on that coffin "court documents to bankrupt rse archive" and move them to the garage where you keep the trash cans and let the stink permeate it. dont give them away this board may need such a complete collection to stop her, or counter for the takedown. [/quote]

Good advice. I kept the tapes under my bed for all these years since they were "restricted" tapes and I didn't want my husband to find them. :oops:
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G2G
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Unread post by G2G »

Understand, please, and in kindness I offer this to you. I consider myself extremely fortunate in that I decided to leave RSE on my own. I wasn't there for very long. I never intended to move there. Those of you who have family members stuck in that "habitrail," I wish the same for them, that they will solidify their doubts and get out of that place. Those who have given up family, friends, jobs, homes, will need a great deal of help. But again, there are others as myself, who sought counseling, continued to read that which revealed the sources of jzrk's "teachings," and who saw the abuse for what it was. I'm off to living my life, and am considerably involved in this political election by way of volunteering my time. In short, I did have to deal with the cheering crowds for the candidate, initially. But I dealt with it. I speak in the name of those few who haven't been in RSE for a long time, and who perhaps were not "completely" convinced, nor did they completely lose all of their critical thinking skills. If my family were to post here in an angry manner over RSE, I can honestly say to them, "why would you bring this into your life, since *I AM OUT* of that place? What have I done to enrage you so that you post in such anger and joshing violence about RSE, which you haven't experienced? What have I done except to try and help you understand why I went, what it was about, and actually laugh about it at times? So why would you then feel such anger toward that which you know not...and I DO know...yet I have left far behind, and you have now moved "within" such? I would ask, are you not perhaps angry over something else, and perhaps vent here?

I simply don't know. I just know that in my own heart, I have peace and wish the same to all. I miss those in my family who have passed on; this would be my biggest grief - not any guilt, not any anger. Yet I also believe those in my family who have passed this world, are not unknown to me even now.
I love them eternally, and I know they, too, love all those they have left.

Perhaps the most important thing I learned at RSE had nothing to do with RSE itself, but in looking at the faces once I realized I'd not be back, I felt deep compassion for them and their toiling, and for those they, too, left behind and who love them still.
"I never really understood religion - it just seemed a good excuse to give" - Ten Years After circa 1972
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xindy
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Unread post by xindy »

G2G said:
I know there are a lot of family members reading here and posting here. I feel for those of you having family leaving/or gone to Yelm. But, for those of you who DO have family members who are "out" of RSE, take a moment and think. Does your family member express "rage" and "violence" toward jzrk? Or have they sought out counseling and feel more a sense of sorrow for the mess jzrk is in? Do they constantly discuss it with you? Or do they rarely mention it? Did they guide you to this sight? Or are you searching on your own? And if so, if your ex-RSE family member/members come here only rarely or are not in obvious "withdrawal," then why are some of you, who haven't been to RSE, feeling so much hate, particularly if your family member is at home, and rarely thinking of RSE? Are you perhaps thinking of RSE more than they are? Because you simply *cannot* know what they experienced for several reasons.
I don't know & haven't heard from other Family Members whose loved one left RSE & returned HOME & who don't need assistance any longer. I seem to BE THE ONLY ONE! My sister gave me the link to EMF so that I could find the information she didn't want to discuss b/c she was OUT OF RSE FOREVER!

I have read Posts from the Old Message Board & had responses from many ex-Ramsters as to my questions. These brave individuals posted outrageous, mind-blowing experiences that I began to feel hatred toward JZK. This wasn't b/c of what my sister experienced but what I had learned from other ex-Ramsters. I felt the pain & agony in each of their experiences & felt the need to express my anger.

It is beyond my comprehension that anyone reading these Posts of such torture these individuals endured for maybe 20-30 yrs. could Just walk away. I choose not to walk away & now I'm here at EMF (not b/c my ex-RSE sister) but b/c of the people I have bonded with on this wonderful web site.

I thought that maybe I could be someone that could somehow help ex-Ramsters & those wavering on the edge of becoming ex-Ramsters. Perhaps I was quite wrong. My intentions were pure. I hate abuse of any kind & the more I've learned about RSE's teachings validate my hatred for the entire concept of its existence.

G2G said:
I'm not angry with jzrk, nor do I wish her harm. I'm simply happy to no longer be there, and it wasn't that long. Nor do I punish myself or feel guilt. I did learn to not throw the baby out with the bathwater.
I'm very happy for you being able to escape without major damage. However, there are people posting on EMF who weren't as fortunate as you. I can't turn my back on them.

If you feel I don't belong on EMF, tell the Moderator & I'm certain I will be kicked off!

Best Wishes to You & Yours.
"I was CULTivated since my birth unintentionally by Parents following Catholicism."
The Quantum Mechanic (TM)
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What to do with all the accumulated materials?

Unread post by The Quantum Mechanic (TM) »

Truster,

I too have contemplated for sometime what to do with over 2 decades of stuff.
Last year, I put what I thought was the majority of every purchased tape, CD, DVD,
and several books that are exclusively part of that experience into rubbermaid totes
and put the lid on them. They were never under my bed, but I didn't want to put them
in the garage. I considered selling them on-line as others here have done. I still consider a garage sale or donating them to a local metaphysical group or church. But,
for the exact reasons you mention, a sense of morality stops me from further promoting something that in the end, did not bring me the empty, but at one-time trusted (sm) ;), teachings. It is because of what they represented to my belief system. Only now can I realize how much of the decisions--key decisions, I based my life choices upon, as a direct and consequential result in my investment in the belief that what I was hearing, what I voluntarily kept treking my way back to, spending money on acquiring virtually all of the materials sold (almost) at the ranch.

I read a post on this site, or elsewhere, of the relief someone had in burying the material, and how the sun actually came out.

I have contemplated a "release ceremony" wherein I might create a fire and release those many items from my physical ability to refer ever again to them, or more of concern, that others in various states of curiousity, might accidentally come across them, and snare them into something, that even if they want to believe in the same things... they can certainly enjoy reading or watching things these days on youtube, or online, either free or without wasting all the time and money.

I know that likely soon I will need to relocate and move. As a cascade of priorities and choices, that my choice to believe in these things--at the expense of other choices I might have made, there is an undeniable link to the particular teachings of the era of rse for me and listening to the master teacher in putting those above my marriage, because the spouse didn't attend the teachings (and would inevitably end, in the teachings). My choice to keep moving, building emergency shelters, store food, withdrew from stock markets years ago, and not do other things to acquire a nest egg of any kind. I don't blame the school, but assume responsibility for my decisions, choices to believe in that. It made me sad, to see the once "lofty", loving teachings on "tolerance" "love" and living sovereignly dramatically abandoned for judgments, and reduced "teachings" of energy, disciplines, all cumulate in... a website that highlights card reading tricks, or encourages people through example to go to gambling casinos, and there they will create their fabulous wealth and sovereignty. Worst of all, is seeing how faithful, loyal, "masters" (past customers) of the school, who genuinely loved, supported, believed in all the causes of the school, are immediately abandoned, maligned under emotionally charged false slander, and falsehoods that they just couldn't do the work, or whatever excuse-du-event was and has been given. This has been going on since the formation of the school. After the Arabian Horse investment retraction, and always the new beginners from around the world are told that THEY are the special ones. That those who have gone before them were not the sincere...

Like many others have shared on the prior site, and the current site, I can relate to many, many of their stories, experiences, and wisdom, when they wake up and literally cannot afford to return, and know in their heart of hearts, that if they did return, to see lost critical belief systems, specific "must do's", prerequisites in the teachings, lost, abandoned, or in the now "haunted neighborhood" of a ghost town where loving souls, gathered together, skeptics and those who wanted to believe, and those who did fully, see their once cherished experiences, gone...

If it really were a path, and skill set one could master, the teachings (legacy or otherwise) would indeed be the cornerstone, hallmarks of the so-called great work.

There are not Alumni of Masters who return, as in graduating classes at Hogwarts, there are not examples in the communities and nations of the world, where one can say, wow! They mastered themselves, are sovereign, fabulously wealthy, kind, loving, tolerant, healing, compassionate souls... and beloved of their master teacher, heirophant, and Brother... no, they are slandered, maligned, even as Dr. Joe, with foul language, and others are ?xposed as all manner of cheater, predator, or worse. Whether they were or not. People believe it.

The self-proclaimed sacred grounds of the ranch, where "fairies" and elementals lived in the woods, and those not in body, flocked there to hear the precious truth and solutions to their next encarnations, and the one-time justification for the rough, simple accomodations (tents, dust/mud, rain, weather) are now marketed where money buys the best ?? seats? and all the teachings on ?nonymous giving, are gone, and those who spend tens and hundreds of thousands of dollars, are brought up as examples for others how they ought to be.

There is much more I could share, but, it has already all been said by so many others on these and other forums.

For those reasons, I can't bring myself to either profit (much needed funds) from the sale of such items, or to tempt others to follow something that in the end, and in these days that are here, are sadly, not of the same "quantum shell" or calibre as the original days.

Still, for the record, I wish no harm, nor ever did, to anyone who propogates, and misleads people knowingly. I still believe in a force, in principles of life, regardless of the names they are called, that will come to those who sow such practices and willful knowing intent.

This may indeed be the evening, or soon, whereby the "gifts of the Gods I have believed in" are offered back into the unknown. There is no doubt they have both effected, and affected me, my family, my life circumstances in a seemingly powerful way. It's just, in my case, and many others... not the so-called created reality, that I thought I was making.

I no longer, if I ever could have at one time, believe in such a business and marketing operations that seems to be able to fleece funds, and infiltrate the belief systems of seekers and believers, in something that now is yet another group, like CUT, or the dozens or hundreds of "followings" that went before it.
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xindy
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Unread post by xindy »

Watcha said:
recently, folks have said "just kidding". i believe they are "just kidding", but at a deeper root, we're witnessing the crying out of pain in their hearts. that, too, needs compassion.
I can't speak for Sad & Oldone but as for myself, I'm crying out of pain in my heart for what YOU, Watcha, Tree, David, & all the others who gave 20 to 30 yrs. of their life to a cause that turned out to be much more than you bargained for & only found it to be a SCAM.

That's who I feel such an intense pain -- not myself!

Love You Survivors!
"I was CULTivated since my birth unintentionally by Parents following Catholicism."
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xindy
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Unread post by xindy »

G2G said:
If my family were to post here in an angry manner over RSE, I can honestly say to them, "why would you bring this into your life, since *I AM OUT* of that place? What have I done to enrage you so that you post in such anger and joshing violence about RSE, which you haven't experienced? What have I done except to try and help you understand why I went, what it was about, and actually laugh about it at times? So why would you then feel such anger toward that which you know not...and I DO know...yet I have left far behind, and you have now moved "within" such? I would ask, are you not perhaps angry over something else, and perhaps vent here?
Wow, I'm glad you're not my sister! My sister only feels Love & Compassion & isn't a vindictive person. My sister is moving on with her life & doesn't talk about JZ/Ramtha anymore, so I don't bring this up to her. Why would a family member or friend want to hurt their loved one in this manner?

I have written why I feel hatred for Mrs. Knight, b/c of the ties I've made with ex-Ramsters here on EMF & their personal stories & how they survived & how some still have a fear in them. I don't feel hatred for Mrs. Knight b/c of my sister...she didn't experience the horrors of those that left their families & moved to Yelm. My sister would understand my anger towards the actual existence of this cult & how I would feel these individual's pain. I'm an empathetic person & my sister would understand that. Love You Sis!

G2G you seem to have a lot of anger in you & if your brother, sister, husband visited EMF & heard the stories of what ex-Ramsters endured, even though you're OUT OF IT, would you want them to turn their backs on the injustice that Mrs. Knight continues to proliferate? Would you be angry with them for finding something like this CULT abominable & feel some hatred for Mrs. Knight?
"I was CULTivated since my birth unintentionally by Parents following Catholicism."
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aussiegirl
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Unread post by aussiegirl »

Wouldn't the best thing be to just throw any RSE material away? There is no reason to keep it, only excuses.
Whatchamacallit
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Unread post by Whatchamacallit »

i would comment that truster has a point....hanging onto rse materials and notes/dates can be useful for legal reasons :wink:
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xindy
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Unread post by xindy »

G2G I have Posted some very PERSONAL Information on the "Friends and Family Members" forum...entitled "Message to G2G."

Please read it. I feel terrible how I reacted to your Post about Family posting hatred things about JZ Knight. My explanation is on this new Post. :?
"I was CULTivated since my birth unintentionally by Parents following Catholicism."
truster
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JZR's whish is to have wine ceremony material removed

Unread post by truster »

Yes one of my favorite candy bars whatchmacalit, i could almost agree to have this material thrown out.
Although for the purpose of legal retribution they should be saved as evidence.
when jzr was liquered up on wine she made a lot of legal mistakes, that affected adults and children.
when i first came to the school the wine ceremony videos were for sale in the quantum cafe and the outback. then she chose to have them removed.
why; for she is trying to remove evidence, lets not make it easy for her.
i was involved in another new age group before i came to rse. when i read the white book i donated all the books to the library. i was beginning to have my doubts with the previous group. they had some hindu name for god, and if you said this name and asked for stuff, from a list of graduated chelas in the upper planes, they would appear and provide and my experiences were constant. they had levels of initiation, and i asked one chela there what is the final initiation where i'm old i am god so therefor i made it all happen, and i was given a cold stare. so i liked rse view that i am god at the deepest level of oneness. but i began to give my power away to these runners from jzr.
now the other group was nowhere near as destrucive as rse. even though it was false, it had some neat fundamentals. just as dianetics makes some sense where psychology meets spitituality, makes some sense where if you remove guilt,lies,sorrow the joy of the thymus/heart will open up and a lot of power accordingy.
a lot of people at the other group know it was contrived by hindu texts and an imaginative mind, they know this; but still like the idea and continue with it.
so if anyone ever experienced a runner congradulate yourself, for you made it happen. things like that take a powerful imagination and faith.
so if you didn't feel loved by the ram cause you didnt get the runner. it could be because all the power for it to happen was sitting in her greedy heart. so take that power back, clean it and start making things happen.
Truster
wolfman

Unread post by wolfman »

"What to do with all the accumulated materials?"

"I too have contemplated for sometime what to do with over 2 decades of stuff." "The Quantum Mechanic"

It has been said that Mick Jaggar of the Rolling Stones, who was deeply involved with the works of Mr. Crowley, never experienced financial freedom (even though the Stones were mega super stars) until after he burned all his Aleister Crowley books.

Then and only then did fabulous wealth come to the Rolling Stones.

Brian Jones ( founder of The Rolling Stones) wasn't so fortunate.

He died young and broke and deluded.

"Wild Horses.........Couldn't drag me away".
Wakeup-Call
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Unread post by Wakeup-Call »

My two cents...

I thought about this quite a bit this summer regarding my Ramtha stash. I reached the conclusion for myself that I would sell the stuff on ebay and craig's list with the attitude of "one man's trash is another man's treasure."

I make sure not to over-hype any of it, just put it out there. It's popular with people overseas particularly. And the out-of-print items sell fast.

Interestingly, I ended up having email conversations with several people...who are so impressed that I was in school for 10 years and lived in the Yelm area. That was strange. But I was able to advise them to really think about their options before selling everything and moving to the USA. Pointed them to some other sites, shared that I personally got more out of Centerpointe's Holosynch than the RSE disciplines, and I also gave them this site for perspective. Since they asked, I shared my viewpoint on RSE.
tree
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Unread post by tree »

Wake Up
Excllent middle of the road, common sense route.
(Isn't this what we are striving for? no fanaticism?)

great way to connect with people and getting out the message without being "in your face" and
"since you asked"

also, Ramster"s LOVE that out of print stuff!
I mean, at this point, I am NOT going to change their mind.
But in regards to giving the stuff away, it might fall into an innocent's hands. THAT I would not like nor agree with.

Hell, sell it to the highest fanatical bidder like she does. They are in it full bore.
Recoup some of your losses this way. And let go of the energy it takes to store the stuff,
AFTER you have processed through it :shock:
truster
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Burning Material

Unread post by truster »

Yeah wolfman burning the material would be a great devil off the sholders feeling.
I might plan to have a bonfire the first equinox after rse is closed down.

and i wonder if mick jagger ever got that huge devil tatoo removed off his chest after he burnt the crowley material?
Another Dimension60
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Unread post by Another Dimension60 »

"Hell, sell it to the highest fanatical bidder"....
What is the difference in this attitude of say a former crack user selling their left over crack to another addict?
How about archiving original tapes and videos in a university library in case someone wants to research, write, expose a dangerous cult? Or donate books that are not about ramtha to a library? Check with a university near you if the Religion or sociology dept. may want to use the material. The webmaster knows at least one university in process of that, perhaps there are others. Or, as Truster says, burn it.
No money will ever replace what was spent, or stolen from us. No dualistic thinking of us vs them will contribute to healing any of us.
tree
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Unread post by tree »

I wasn't thinking of dualitic terms here.
In my case, I have had less than optimal means of supporting myself since leaving,
and making any chunk of money is worth it, ESPECIALLY if I know by their e-bay moniker
that they are fully indoctrinated by RSE. I am in no way going to convince them that
what they are doing is under mind control.
They have the discretionary cash, it might as well go in MY pocket instead of JZ's.
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David McCarthy
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Unread post by David McCarthy »

I am in no way going to convince them that
what they are doing is under mind control.
They have the discretionary cash, it might as well go in MY pocket instead of JZ's.
Tree,

I understand your point that selling RSE propaganda material back to Ramtha fanatics will make little difference to them..
Perhaps an EMF book marker will help..!
chuckle.
but surely "convincing them" is really not at issue here.
RSE members have families, friends and loved ones that wish nothing to do with RSE, they are totally innocent,
yet are still caught up in the RSE snare, many have been devastated and destroyed by RSE.
Do you not think that those that buy the RSE recruiting propaganda will try and use it on others?

Another Dimension60 makes a good point, lets try and keep the RSE seductive poison off the streets as much as possible.

Is the money worth it?

David.
But he has nothing on at all, cried at last the whole people....
California Dreamin'
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Unread post by California Dreamin' »

Tree and David -

I can see and understand where both of you are coming from.

Remember -- not that you need reminding -- we are processing out (years of) damage resulting from the twisted and deceptive cult we were a part of.

As I see it, we're all fortunate to have found each other and to have this forum on which to share our experiences and thoughts.
Wakeup-Call
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Unread post by Wakeup-Call »

I think this is a choice that is personal, that there's not an obvious best path regarding what to do with the RSE materials.

Another point that factored into my decision to sell and something I included in my comments when asked why I was selling... I personally don't think the whole ball of RSE teachings is garbage, just recycled. My point of view is that JZ plagiarized and added her own spin. So there is within the content something to be gained, just can do it more cheaply and effectively elsewhere.

Another point of view - I would rather this stuff not be rare and hard to find and buy. I remember when I sold my Last Waltz of the Tyrants book a year ago that it had gone for as high as $800 on ebay. I sold mine for $100 - way cheap at the time. And now it can be found for $20 on ebay or Amazon.com. When a book is selling for $800, it implies some great wisdom. When people are willing to dump it for $20, it's just a book, not "my precious." I like sending the message that if someone who's been in school a long time is willing to part with it, it maybe is not all THAT special.

Especially the items that JZ wanted banned and destroyed should be kept in circulation so people can see the swearing, drinking, smoking while she's working to make Ramtha respectable.

I agree with Tree that anyone willing to pay $250 for Jaime Leal's unfocused, meandering, pointless books was well-hooked on Ramtha before I posted the item for sale.

Philosophically, we're having the same conversation as if we were talking about whether drugs should be legalized.
ordinarymind
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Unread post by ordinarymind »

Hi everyone ?I?ve been wrestling with this one myself ?I did burn all of my Ramtha books last winter ?.except for a couple I found this summer ?putting all those books into the fire in my wood stove seemed to be what I needed to do at the time .. .I sat with a glass of wine and watched them burn ?.I wouldn?t say it was cathartic, or releasing or anything ?it just felt like that was what I needed to do ? .I didn?t want those books and those words in my possession any more.

I?m not so sure about what to do with all the cassette tapes and a few cd?s and videos ?I resist taking them to the landfill ?I don?t want to make the Earth take them back . ..sorry if that sounds silly, but it just doesn?t seem ?fair? to make the Earth deal with them ?so I procrastinate ?I have a lifetime supply of cassettes if I ever wanted to record over them, so I suppose that is one solution ?the same with the few cd?s ?.I did think of selling the video?s ?but I guess it is true, for me anyway, that I don?t want to spread them around now that I have settled into my belief that RSE is a cult.

So, I?m still wondering what to do . .. I really don?t want to sell them, although I must admit my ears perked up when WakeUpCall mentioned Last Waltz of the Tyrants was selling for $800 on ebay last year!! It?s hard not to be motivated by money after all those years of not having any.
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G2G
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Unread post by G2G »

:) If anyone would like to part with their copy of "Where Angels Fear to Tread"....I've been looking for it. From the few minutes of it I did see, I'd like to view the remainder and share it with those in the "real world" outside of RSE, so that some may see what really went on at some events.
8) 8) 8)
"I never really understood religion - it just seemed a good excuse to give" - Ten Years After circa 1972
Whatchamacallit
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Unread post by Whatchamacallit »

a few more thoughts...

in the end, i do agree that it is our own personal choice what we do. if it's not, then we're not free to make the decision, even if there was proof it was a "wrong" decision.

if we sell our materials to get some money back, that's one issue. years ago, another "channeler" i had gone to, and had a small amount of materials, i just tossed into a donation box. i figured if someone else chose to buy them, that's their business. at THAT TIME, it seemed okay to me, to do that. now, i wouldn't do that. i have since asked myself, "what if some naive teenager got their hands on some of that stuff and went onto a path that caused them discord ?" but at that time, i wasn't as concerned about the cult aspect of it all, either.

it's about "sharing"... causing or allowing... the info to get into anyone else's hands, or not.
that can happen by obtaining money for the items or donating them to an known or unknown group or individual.

then again...i've been in used book stores where there is all manner of religious/new age books. so i have asked myself, again, if it's a person's choice to buy a book about the new age, or the king james version of the bible, or the koran, the talmud, buddhism, etc, ...is that MY business ? there are people who would have issues with some or all of those topics.

so in the end, it's about, IN MY OPINION, what we can feel morally comfortable with. while i have my preference for what i'd like to see people do with rse materials, it's really not my decision, lest i become the dictator that jzr is.

it reminds me, too, of jzr having temper tantrums at the students about bringing them down or getting rid of them from the school, if they engaged any other teachers in addition to jzr. if i want to attend rse and also be a jew, that's my business !!!! but jzr has seriously criticized doing just that. i saw 'him' (rambles) rip into one particular person for being a jew...as they are behind the conspiracy theories of the DTC, the person was criticized for hanging on to the attitudes of that belief system.

that brings me to another post i don't have time for right now....about the dvd the protocols of the elders of zion. it's not about the jews being guilty !!!! why didn't jzr know that, and why was it promoted...but...jz has freedom of speech...

AND SO DO WE.
tree
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Unread post by tree »

David-
I am nor sure I am getting your point you made.

I was purely just making my point from a personal perspective.
With serious mental health issues for the first year and a half I was out,
there was little help anywhere to help pay the bills just to survive.

My very first weekend when my friend flew out, I lay on the ground writhing in utter emotional pain,
unable to move except blather the word, "BURN THAT!!!"
I could not even move my body while this was happening.
My friend had started a bon fire outside and as I pointed to things,
she took them out and burned them.
Cathartic, to say the least.
T-shirts (17 of them- all cotton), books, cards, Christmas cards from JZ..almost anything ranch related.
I fell asleep in a numb stupor.

Several weeks later, as I was moving into another one of my cabins, I ran across the entire Legacy series.
Whtat to do with this before coveted ream of CD's?
I saved and saved for those, over $700 in total.
I was renting one of my places to a Ramster at the time.
And upon them moving out, (I was at the stage of ANY REMOTELY looking like ranch stuff just made
my skin crawl), I said, "here. Take these. I know you will appreciate these more than me."
To which she ran into the house and screamed on the phone to her friend. "OMG! Look what I manifested!!!"

I now see I could have sold them for at least the same monetary price as I paid for them,
and let them go for the same emotional price to me.

You know, it is NOT like giving a crack addict more crack.
IF a crack addict is in a recovery program and is making strides to rid themselves of their addiction,
of COURSE I am not going to give them a gift certificate to "Pipes R Us" :roll:

I still personally know of several people who think my exit is just one of ill harbored feelings over
several instances at the ranch. It couldn't be further from the truth.
You cannot tell a Ramtha addict that it is brainwashing and mind control.
On the other hand, I am not goint to stand on a street corner handing out RSE paraphenalia and material.

If the people are still IN, that is one thing.
If they are out, or are doubting, or family members of RSE students, that is a whole nother matter.
I am NOT going to give RSE material to a Ramster's kid. wth?

I personally do not have one single stand-by-all answer for this question.
It would be like opening a can of personal worms in regards to the issue of abortion,
Which of course, I had to deal with as well having had the experiences I did at the Ranch.
I would NOT wish that decision on ANYONE.
It is heart wrenching.

Best of luck to all in wrestling with this highly personal decision.
tree
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Unread post by tree »

ps

If it had not been for my personal financial struggle and crisis (which I am still enduring,
but without the as-serious-mental-health aspects), I would have just dug a hole
with the backhoe and threw the entire lot in there. the end.
wolfman

Unread post by wolfman »

One way to "burn" the most outrageous of Ramtha videos (Rockumentary, Two Paths, Self Betrayal, A Classic Teaching of Christmas) is to BURN them to DVD and post them on "You Tube".

It ridiculous to think that these recordings will stay buried in the woods at Jza Jza Galores house as if they never happened.

AND ITS EVEN MORE RIDICULOUS TO THINK THAT THE REASON THAT PEOPLE WERE TOLD TO DESTROY THEIR PERSONAL COPIES WAS BECAUSE JZA JZA DIDN'T WANT A RECORD OF HER SMOKING AND DRINKING.

YOUR'E A LIAR JUDI !!!!!!!! AND YOU KNOW WHO I AM ! YOU'VE LOOKED INTO MY EYES BEFORE AND ONCE THE WOLFMAN HAS GLARED AT YOU, THE TRUTH SOON VOMITS UP. As you very well remember from more than just one occasion.

"BRING FORTH THE TECH WIZARDS TO BRING THOSE RECORDINGS TO "YOU TUBE".... AND MAKE THIS SO"

SO SAY I FROM THE LORD GOD OF MY BEING !

Not all the copies are destroyed you know.
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David McCarthy
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Unread post by David McCarthy »

"BRING FORTH THE TECH WIZARDS TO BRING THOSE RECORDINGS TO "YOU TUBE".... AND MAKE THIS SO"
Thank you for that wolfman.

This is an extremely effective and powerful method of unmasking "Ramtha"...!
For those Wizards contemplating the casting of some "You tube" magic...
take a look at this...

YouTube - Fair Use and Free Speech

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GY-2Yshu ... re=related :



David :lol:
But he has nothing on at all, cried at last the whole people....
tree
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fAIR USE

Unread post by tree »

Legally quoting somebody else's copyrighted music, pictures or words
without paying or asking permission-if it benefits society
more than it hurts its copyright holder.
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G2G
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Unread post by G2G »

Tada!... :) Education....history....etc. = fair use...
8) 8) 8)
"I never really understood religion - it just seemed a good excuse to give" - Ten Years After circa 1972
wolfman

Unread post by wolfman »

FAIR USE

I experienced all the videos that I quoted.

The TRUTH presented in them and mined by ME is MINE.

I WILL DO WHAT I PLEASE WITH THEM, AT THIS TIME, THRU THE VENUE KNOWN AS YOU-TUBE.

(Sue You- Tube Judi.)

"the path "of" the yellow brick road requires the actual Wearing of the rose/gold slippers"

I own my own pair. Do you Judy....... aka........ "To Serve With Love" ?

So you see Captain Mike..........Your still a GI Joe.
Whatchamacallit
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Unread post by Whatchamacallit »

Wolf said, "AND ITS EVEN MORE RIDICULOUS TO THINK THAT THE REASON THAT PEOPLE WERE TOLD TO DESTROY THEIR PERSONAL COPIES WAS BECAUSE JZA JZA DIDN'T WANT A RECORD OF HER SMOKING AND DRINKING. "

Oh, yeah. I was there for that nonsense. NO WAY was I about to destroy my copies. I still have them in brand new condition ! Along with way too many other RSE materials. I remember "Ramble" saying that the teachings were about to go global, so "we need to clean up our act here". THAT was one of the more honest comments ever made. Destroying those damning videos (The Two Paths and The Rockumentary), we were told that the primary reason (no pun intended, LOL) was because JZ had a new timeline now, since she "never smoked" and/or drank, so the videos of that occurring, couldn't possibly remain in her timeline !


Youtube....what a great idea. What if we all did different ten minute segments from the same video ? LOL ! Sounds like fun if one has a sense of humor ! :twisted:
truster
Posts: 91
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Hi Tecks Posting On You Tube

Unread post by truster »

I was just thinking that before i poisen the air with jzr smoke from my bonfire, or the earth with her stuff from burying, wouldn't it be good to mother earth if we set up peace with mother earth first by exposing it with a description of the reason why it is being posted so it wont seem like it is bieng posted as a promotion.


off topic here i know some Hi Tekers who know ways to be invisible on the internet.
The notebook should be purchased from someone else paid with cash for cheap. then get a program that will clean the hard drive 5 levels deep, so it is invisible to forensics, then flash and rewrite the bios by flashing it.
reinstall windows, get a program to hide your IP Address, get a phoney e-mail account while logging in at a coffee shop with no cameras or in front of someones house that is transmitting internet, or an apartment complex with numerous internet signals that have no security cameras. log on to you tube sign up with the phoney e-mail account, and post all videos to expose the truth, with a message to copy the video and to keep redistributing it to keep it alive.
Because you know the ramsters get RSS feeds to be notified of any rse or ramtha videos, and they will submit redflags and try to get it removed, or try to find the poster for court money to purchase 1000 port-a-potties if the clothing auction doesn't pan out.
Then never use the notebook again except for reposting the video under a different e-mail adress from a safe location.
I love you tube!!!!!!!
Of course i dont reccomend this, i have just observed that there are ways from hearing the Hi Tekkers talking.
Truster
truster
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A TV Or Tube is like a box says Grandpa

Unread post by truster »

You Tube is like a box that has a video screen
Like Grandpa says " put it in a box" and imprison it.
lets go global with this.
truster
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Can Anyone Reccomend Video Editing Software

Unread post by truster »

I was just laying down to sleep and a hypnogogic moment struck, so I must get this topic posted.
So i just watched Fair Rights video.
It mentions your quotations of past material is allowed.
So i just got an image to use video editing software to place watermarked quotations of your opinion respectively during specific video segments.
Also not to post the entire video, but to cut and reattach the video stream to the next quotation topic.
Of course freeware would be the best source to begin looking for this software.
We dont want rse to cost us even a dime (the 32 president)!
good night,
truster
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G2G
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Unread post by G2G »

Taglines - YouTube taglines. And you don't post the url - you email it. So it gets pulled off - it goes up again.

It's for the "greater good"....indeed! :wink:
"I never really understood religion - it just seemed a good excuse to give" - Ten Years After circa 1972
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G2G
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Unread post by G2G »

Oh, hello Mike! How's it going?
8) 8) 8)
"I never really understood religion - it just seemed a good excuse to give" - Ten Years After circa 1972
truster
Posts: 91
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Taglines

Unread post by truster »

G2G your teaching me now.
I know what a tag is-a tag can be like: ramtha,rse,the secret,obama(so everyone will know),jzknight,cult,mind control
these general tags will link searches of these words to our videos.
but how do you do a tagline with no url and e-mail submit?
truster
Posts: 91
Joined: Tue Oct 07, 2008 12:12 am

Possible find on video editing software

Unread post by truster »

I was looking in freeware and there are a few, but seem to be worthwile.
I did find a great program called Muvee (truster does not promote this software only quotes upon it- protected by the fair use act)
This video editing software offers a free 15 day trial which should be plenty enough time to mainifest several videos onto youtube.
I hope this helps,
truster
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