The EnlightenMeFree (EMF) Online Debate Forum

I have never been to an RSE event but am writing on request of a friend who was a member for many many years and has now stopped going , partly due to my showing her this site,. I will share a bit of my experience but will not likely continue to post. I found this site and sent her some specific postings that were written from people?s personal experience, and described the confusions about what to believe and what to reject. This open inquiry and sharing of the human vulnerability of sorting confusing messages, I felt would be heard by her and considered much more deeply than the blameful reactivity that some people have about the Ramtha experience. Those reactions are totally justifiable and understandable for some people in some stage of the process of leaving , but can also just triggers a wall of defense for students still embedded in RSE. It is nice to see the diversity on this site as different things speak to different people..

I will speak about my process of getting to know someone who already was a ?Rampster?. I had heard of Ramtha. previously and only associated him/her with being for weirdos. So I had to sort my own biases when I got to know my friend, as I felt she was very intelligent and had integrity in so many ways but seemed to be getting some needs met by this school that I did not understand. So then I just said ?well who am I to think I know everything about some school and person I have never experienced?. I was able to stay in a place of being curious as to what this experience was for my friend. But whenever she shared RSE videos or books, I was totally put off by the drama and the huge gaps between what was supposedly the principles of the school and how it seemed that the Ram was actually relating to people. To me the message was absolutist, demeaning, judgemental and patronizing even whilst using words of expanded consciousness, and love etc.

I think we all can be prone to espouse something, use the high moral language, even though it is really beyond what we have integrated and can actually enact. Without being able to reflect on that difference, to inquire into the depths of our own gaps or allow others to do so too, means we can stay blind, rigid and defended, and have a hidden unacceptable ?shadow? side. I think the most likely indicator of a truly wise mentor is this inquiry into self, and awareness that we are always learning and evolving. This does not seem at all present at RSE where a questioning mind seems to indicate weakness. So an unquestioned shadow side grows larger and larger. I can only speculate, but I wonder if JZ read the inspiring words of Cayce, quantum physics etc. years ago, and felt truly moved by the potential of their insights, then got attached to the desire to be the hero spreading the word. Then she became more and more invested in that role and less able to do the vulnerable and humbling work of honest inquiry as to whether she really understood or lived by their words. So fundamentalism can get seeded this way and eventually becomes a ? your either on the bus or off the bus? cult with all kinds of rules which make sure the shadow side stays unquestioned and hidden.

But if I zoom out into a bigger picture, I feel we all know the experience of getting caught in illusions/ beliefs which are destructive. The promise of industrialization and the American Dream are enticing and all consuming and therefore as dangerous to us as a cult. We have been blindly going along hoping that someone or something out there was taking care of it all, that there were no limits to growth, that we could throw our garbage away without it harming anything, could use pesticides and fossil fuels as much as we wanted to without any repercussions. We are now just starting to wake up and question these beliefs and see how destructive they ae, but still it is hard to change our dependence, give up the addicting behavior and go against the status qou. I go on about this in this posting mainly to say how I think we all can get caught inside beliefs that frame how the world works and they ?have us? , instead of us? having them?. It can be hard to get perspective. Years from now, we ( future cultures) will likely look back on this era and say, just like ex RSE students are saying, ?what the f? were we thinking!!!?. So I think for outsiders who wonder why their friends or family are in this ?cult?, it is good for us to look at situations where we also have been caught in an illusion/ seeking a dream outside of ourselves. This might allow us to be more understanding and patient. Judging and blaming ourselves or each other just slows the whole process of learning and growing.

I have so much admiration for how my friend has been willing to listen to her and others doubts. It takes so much courage to feel this disturbance, let the ground underneath you be shaken, to be willing to ask hard questions about that which we trusted as the only truth . From the bit I have read on the site, I am also so admiring of the honest sharing that people are doing, trying to sort it all out: laughing at themselves for what they believed in, being tender with themselves for the hopes they projected out there, being hurt at how hard the lessons have been. I think when we learn from these challenges it means they are not wasted

inquire-
I am in awe of your post.
very touching. very allowing of you. and very brave of you to share this site with your friend.

very brave of your friend to withstand the :

courage to feel this disturbance, let the ground underneath you be shaken, to be willing to ask hard questions about that which we trusted as the only truth

So fundamentalism can get seeded this way and eventually becomes a ? you're either on the bus or off the bus? cult with all kinds of rules which make sure the shadow side stays unquestioned and hidden.

very astute observation.

And than god I had the wherewithall to get off the bus. There are other means of transport

-signed
my new acronym,
"off the bus"


peace.....

Thank you for your beautiful and caring remarks, Inquire.

I've been wondering how new members to this website initially learned of EMF. Myself, I slipped in through the back door while doing a google search. When I found this site I was still on-board with RSE, although my status with RSE was inactive.

Then I started reading this site and watched the LARSE videos. I started by watching Carroll Cobbs, since I knew him, and I was blown away by what he said. After spending many hours reading the EMF site, I was stunned/shocked and a wave of knowingness hit me -- RSE is a CULT and I have been a cult groupie all of these years. My family was right, and I was wrong (huge admission).

I've been dealing with this newfound revelation ever since -- talk about being humbled. . . .

Thank you Inquire-Me-Free for your gentle and thoughtful sharing.

Just this morning, I was contemplating just how far back any of us as individuals, as a society, or even historically, would have to go to discover a time when we were not subtly conditioned to have the need and compelling desire to seek outside of ourselves, out of our own life experiences to have to be indoctrinated, taught, educated, saved, rescued, mentored, counseled, in order to be deemed worthy or acceptable in the eyes of others. This might be family, friends, teachers, counselors, loved ones, those who believe they are in control due to perceived power and wealth (either born into it, married into it, or self-made).

At least in this lifetime, and in the Western world, most are born into families with religious traditions. Most current religions have all manner of super-natural writings out of holy books, stories, and 'rules and regulations' (Thou shalt nots, proverbs, commandments, or modern day "spiritual principles" that are presented 'as fact' and repeated by the flock, and new converts.


Then, there are the loving (or dysfunctional) (Future historians will decide) things done in the name of tradition or culture. Take Santa Claus, The Tooth Fairy, The Easter Bunny, as an example. Innocent children, trusting loving, are taught about these magical beings who bring gifts and money, and colored easter eggs and chocolates. But even then, one of the benefits of such stories, is it helps well meaning parents with "better do this or that, or else" or "better be a good girl or boy", after all "He's making a LIST (SM) ;) and checking it twice , going to find out who is naughty or nice. (SM).. I 'm sure you see where I'm going with this here?

So between the cultural, traditions and religions (God knows our every thought and deed, and the world of sins, whether contemplated or commited doesn't matter.. and the only way out of this world, is to become converted into whatever local gathering or tradition one is born into in the world). So, many children do as they are told... for a time anyway, and be the good girls and boys in order to please their parent or parents, their family, and some are ultimately doing it to please God. To quote Seinfeld, "not that there's anything wrong with that!"

Eventually, people grow up biologically (not necessarily maturing along the way) and 'life happens'. Things get stickier and seemingly more complicated when one tries to make it on their own. In most parts of so-called civilization, we are in the post industrial world, with the global age of capitolism. It's all about products and services that we are brainwashed and programmed into believing we need. Everything from shelter, clothing, toys for all ages, the do's and don'ts of fashion. We're constantly being bombarded with the need for ever increasing number of products, medicines, pain relievers, classes, groups, and solutions for our present, our dysfunctional (we're told) pasts, and warned to prepare for the future, and the need to invest in the stock market, mutual funds, investments, real estate-- of ever increasing square footage, value and style.

Our great grand parents, grand parents and parents raised large families in homes the same size or smaller than our two or three car garages. And recent generations, if they have children at all, often have very small families.

The old paradigms and traditions and roles men and women played has changed. Now both working or single (divorced) parents each try to make it on their own. Often, their credit rating tumbles, making it more difficult to find employment, make ends meet, or charged interest rates, and insurance premiums more than others, due to life circumstances.

The media has expanded from the radio programs which fostered imagination, and the world of heros in sports, in stories, even in presidents was once a sense of purpose or security. Now, there is 24 hour a day news, propaganda, trashy rumors (known as dirt), about everything and everyone who makes it above radar... and even the poor are now told how they can live or not live in their trailers, with cats, dogs, and diverse hobbies.

It is in such a world, that just like happened to Pinnochio on his way to school, it is not hard to understand how it is possible for otherwise "intelligent" or educated, kind, loving, caring people to be caught off guard with all manner of offer. From all the products on the infomercials, grow hair, get rid of hair, a million weight control and diet solution plans, health and natural, and food products, packages and recipes that dazzle the Gods themselves.

Children no longer can look to their parents and see demonstration that hard work and loyalty pay off, for the gold=watch and retiring from one, two or even three companies in one's life are long gone. Most people are unaware in th U.S. of A. that many utility companies with Water, Electricity, Gas, are (ultimately) owned by foreign countries. More and more people are now aware that their food companies, and breweries, are not the one-time American owned world they grew up in, or in believing.

Is it any wonder that with a lifetime of conditioning, from childhood on, that all walks of life might listen to anyone or anything (Real, Imagined or Contrived) that offers answers, health, healing, the illusory romantic love, soul mate , cures for illness, cancer, even live for years, 250 years?

We are taught that once people believed the world was flat, that Columbus 'discovered' America in 1492 (what a surprise to those many nations and peoples living there for generations).

Eventually, time... the great healer and true enlightener... will cast most everything in new light.

When our loved ones die of disease, of cancer, of old age, and their voice is heard no more, we question, at some point, what was it all about?

Maybe someday the need for others to find fulfillment, actualization, and the psychological need for affirmation of who and what someone is, through the roles one plays as daughter, son, sister, brother, mother or dad, employee, employer, and all manner of inventive occupation and job title and description, will be fulfilled.

Maybe then, when we can't be disuaded by others coming in the name of God, or the Truth, or their polarized fanatical opinion of who, how and when one is allowed to do, to be, to think, to laugh, and to live.. will be closer to the many wars faught to this very hour in the name of "the freedom to choose, known as free will" or "Freedom".

As was once espoused from the indoor horse arena that believers were willing to suspend disbelief and call the Great Hall, "Only Truth has the power to frighten, or move people" (sic).
Like invasive pathogens of bacteria, or weeds in the garden... unless carefully attended, the plethora of products, [tapes, CD's, DVD's, books, posters, capes, pillows, blindfolds, potions-lotions-pills-and snake oils, clustered, sea, and bottled water, red wine, goat cheese, music recordings from movie soundtracts, new age artists, retro classic rock'n'roll, all eventually consume whatever may have once been "that which is termed the beautious and bewitching rose in the garden, or the great Tree, liken unto Shambala, or the great armies, or the unseen brotherhood, the ascended masters, still watching and hearing every thought, every action, reaction, deed and the ulterior motive therof, the great battles of Light & Darkeness, of good against Evil, of Ignorance, Superstition and dogma, will indeed 'one fine day' be dissolved even as the Ancient Sun (with Helios & Vesta dancing in the middle of it, ECP's CUT) will send the cosmic rays and melt, transmute the silliness, and things of the childhood of the era of man and the womb of man, known as woman, and Nature will again be a pardise upon this capitolized world of lack and need. And no one will any longer be parted from whatever it is that they, themselves cherish and hold dear. Not their life, their innocence, their Trust, their right to live, to be free from fear, anxiety and the Chicken Littles of the World will be liken unto those with their heads cut off running about aimlessly. And the Great Emporers-Without-Clothes, will be able to be seen for who and what they are, and no one will any longer pretend unto them out of fear, or retribution, or a sense to belong.

On that fine day, it is a day that not only is to come, but a day and an hour -- that is indeed already here... The dead in Christ, and the fallen "Masters" and "Believers" of all ers, time and the age of such things, will be swallowed up in great, loving, forgiveness and heart-felt laughter.

Wishing you and your loved ones, the gift of the remaining days of the gift of this thing we call Life... may we all enjoy the people, the places, the things, and everything that brings us happiness, joy, love and a sense of purpose...

Owa Tagu Siam

See&E

Hi Inquire,

Please tell your friend to consider reading books, articles, blogs ... whatever it takes, to keep on self educating about "cults" such as RSE. I think it's fair to say that one can gain not only a deep insight into the psychology of what goes on in a place like RSE, from start to finish, but also, hope for the future.

The people that exit such groups all have stories to tell. They're different in specifics, but they are the same in emotions. There is no good way to realize that one has spent time in a place that lied and misled us. It hurts, and most people go through a similar pattern of questioning and feeling emotions related to it all.

Eventually, as you said, we do learn from the challenges, which means that they were not wasted. We learned in spite of our RSE experience, not with any due credit to it. For myself, I like an analogy someone once used years ago. The person said that we don't have to taste a sour pickle to know that ice cream is sweet. There are just different flavors of ice cream to experience ! With humor, that's how I personally sum up my RSE journey. I could have learned from life, the ice cream way, and forgone the sour pickle. But, since I didn't, I can make up for lost time now.

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