The EnlightenMeFree (EMF) Online Debate Forum

---Moderator comment---
This post has been moved from the "General Chit Chat & Social Forum".


Does ANYONE know where I could get a copy of the old Rockumentary with JZ? We are putting together a "documentary" and since I am a former RSE student, some things in that piece would be very helpful as I tell the NewStory ( my version of course!LOL)
Thanks for any info. on the subject! and HEY DAVID how are U??? we r doing great, snowed in but lovin' life in general... drop us an email, same ol address.

DanceTheWind.

DanceTheWind,

Its good to hear from you.
We are snowed in also..just a few inches, but its a winter wonderland.

We are putting together a "documentary"

Great...
Check your PM box.

We are doing very well.. thank you.
chat real soon,

David.

I have a copy. PM me and I'll get it to you.

We are putting together a "documentary" ..
since I am a former RSE student, some things in that piece would be very helpful as I tell the NewStory ( my version of course!LOL)

DanceTheWind,
Because we have been communicating "off line"... I now understand that you are very supportive of RSE,
and that on all levels RSE was apparently a wonderful experience for you....!

Hopefully my following questions to you will open up an honest and respectful dialogue here on EMF.

How do you feel/think about JZ Knight and her RSE organization ?
Is your "documentary project"..intended to be somewhat supportive of the "Ramtha" doctrines ?
or supportive of RSE in any way ?

David.

P.S.
Here is an explanation of why EMF exist.

What is 'Enlightenmefree' for? The Purpose.

The Enlighten Me Free (EMF) website has been created, in part, to make public some questions regarding the authenticity of the alleged channeling of the entity "Ramtha."
We are former students of Ramtha?s School of Enlightenment (RSE) from various worldwide locations who have come to seriously question whether "Ramtha" is real and whether or not the whole concept of "channeling" as it exists within the New Age movement is valid.
Our primary purpose with this website is to provide an online support community. Within it we will provide space for networking, educational information, opinion sharing, asking questions, and sharing of facts. There are also ongoing physical support meetings with L.A.R.S.E. (Life After RSE) participants. We welcome participation from people who have also been affected with doubts from experiences connected to RSE.
If you are a current, former, or prospective student of ?Ramtha? and have no doubts or issues about his "teachings", then this may not be the place for you. The information provided on this site is the observation and/or opinion of the writers. EMF & L.A.R.S.E. are independent and have no affiliation with JZK, Inc., or Ramtha?s School of Enlightenment. Please read the disclaimer page.
To contact EMF email info@enlightenmefree.com
Home Page
http://www.enlightenmefree.com/

Your amazing David. These are my posts? hugh? really?
What a hoot, talk about an expose someone should do one on the game your running here on this site.
What a SHAME you ought to b ASHAMED of yourself USING these people like this.

Sorry, but the administrator has prevented you from sending private message

I get it, (LOA)I got what I expected and by the way... what I WANTED.

Your just a F'in crazy as that Daffy Duck character your sooooooooo pissed at... JZ KNIGHT. You DESERVE EACHOTHER.

Most people (as creative as you) dont go to disney land for the kicks and giggles, get pissed off at what Mickey said and what Mickey did, move next door to Disney land and spend the rest of their LIVES pissin' & moanin' about how Mickey is a butt-head and is blah-blah-blah.... and even if SOME people (as creative as you) DID find they had done just this..... EVENTUALLY they may tire of the whole gig and live the LIFE they came here to...... (get this part) L I V E


Now David, considering I used many LETTERS of our alphabet in the above "POST" (haha) I suppose you could cut and paste EACH LETTER that YOU DESIRE in what ever CONFIGURATION that you desire and then QUOTE ME!!!! and post THAT under my name, go ahead I am giving YOU permission... OH wait a minuet (like the dance) you dont NEED MY PERMISSION!!! LOL

YOUR the head GURU here in this little corner of disney land.

This sure was FUN :o) have a great day

Methinks: "not really a "dancer," are you "wind?"

(Mike - you're so cute when you're angry!)

David - I suspect someone is attempting to get their hands on Judith's "plagiarized" teachings as well as her videotaped obnoxious behavior (and yes, she did "indeed" plagiarize then pile the whole shebang together). Judith Alder? The Ramayana and Ram of the Hindus? The "seven planes of existence" a la Buddhism? What of the "orbs" which are in some of MY photographs long before 2000? I won't even mention Castanados or Blavatsky intertwined with masonic inserts et al. Nearly everything taught is "plagiarized" from elsewhere.

Wake up!!!! (does that sound familiar?)

Hey, hey, my, my...why should any one of us be surprised?
(I hear that Gas-X helps with "wind dancing" so as to lessen one's discomfort) Shall we send some to those with "gusty" problems?

wtf?

Tree wrote:wtf?

Yeah, exactly . ..wtf? . ...I think I must have missed something while I was away on Christmas vacation?

I get that message about "sorry the administrator has prevented you from sending a private message" . ..but that doesn't mean a conspiracy or anything ...sheesh ...what is going on with you DancetheWind?

I could be wrong, but I thought there was more to the posts I read, or a longer post from "wind." It appears that "wind" was playing both sides - then severaly bashed David - of all people.

Methinks "wind" is simply "breaking wind." Imo, it all looked to be a set-up by a current RSE'er or staff - from all that I'd read (but doesn't seem to all be here now and imo, it shouldn't be - it was horrendous on "wind's" part, imo. Hence, my response.

Ramtha - "lord of the wind?" aka as nothing but a big phart...
If there ever were a "true" being as such, altruistic to "stay behind" and "teach" - then that being ought come forth and acknowledge the wrong done on it's behalf. It's a fairy tale by Judith Hampton, imo.

Now about that Gas-X....it's OTC, "windbreaker." Anything with the ingredient simethicone (pharmaceutically speaking) ought do the same lest one be tempted to gloss their long blonde exensions with the hair products containing similar ingredients...

Ramtha - "lord of the wind?" aka as nothing but a big phart...

Too funny, G2G!!

Happy New Year everyone. Take care of yourselves.

THIS IS A "QUOTE" from our website, with the description of our "DOCUMENTARY" project. Since my website link was removed by David as well as my ability to respond to anyone, I thought perhaps as a fare-thee-well I may be allowed to put it here?


QUOTE:
As students of the Teachings of Abraham as channeled thru Esther Hicks we are in the process of living a NewStory and that journey has brought us to you! Our intentions are to produce a series of programs and/or a film of ?NewStory?s. We look forward to going on the road to film ?Innerviews? for this production. If you are interested in being a part of this co-creation, please feel free to contact us.
Here?s what we are looking for:
You?ve been consciously using the Universal Law of Attraction for a while?You may have heard about LOA from any number of the various sources of information ?out there? on it, and you have found a ?Home? in the Art of Allowing teachings as taught by Abraham thru Esther Hicks.
Your old story is a thing of the past? it?s practically gone in the dust of your footsteps THIS STUFF WORKS for you!
We would be honored to share our story ;and yours with an audience.
Note: As students of Abraham-Hicks we are not in anyway other than as students of these teachings, connected to or affiliated with the Abraham-Hicks website, publications or it?s affiliates.
Nor are any of our projects, connected to theirs. END QUOTE

I also went back and copied my posts from when I was an active member (DanceTheWind)of this forum, jan-Mar 07 and it appears that all's still the same here. Same old way of dealing with opinions that are not those of those in control. Censorship.

Reminds me alot of my little 18 month stint at RSE.

Have a lovely day :o)

As is often the case with RSE supporters, rather than debate the issues related to their RSE experience
they choose to go on the offensive, with personal attacks and sowing seeds of mistrust on EMF.
DanceTheWind is no exception.

I also went back and copied my posts from when I was an active member (DanceTheWind)of this forum, jan-Mar 07 and it appears that all's still the same here. Same old way of dealing with opinions that are not those of those in control. Censorship.

Now David, considering I used many LETTERS of our alphabet in the above "POST" (haha) I suppose you could cut and paste EACH LETTER that YOU DESIRE in what ever CONFIGURATION that you desire and then QUOTE ME!!!! and post THAT under my name, go ahead I am giving YOU permission... OH wait a minuet (like the dance) you dont NEED MY PERMISSION!!! LO

DanceTheWind,
I am consulting with the EMF moderators the option to post ?Uncensored? all our 'off line" private email communications to date..
I understand full well that posting our private emails on line is breaching an unspoken trust and confidentiality.
But I can see no other remedy to right the wrongs you have accused me and EMF of, in your vitriolic posts.
Although, I don?t expect you to change your supportive views regarding RSE.."I am not talking about JZ Knight"..!
It will shed some backlight into the communications and steps we have both shared to arrive at this disturbing juncture,
and hopefully from the record of our emails made public on EMF your divisive comments and false accusations can be seen from
"In my opinion" a true perspective and dispelled.
JZR/RSE will use and betray the very ethics and trust of those she/it enslaves as a profoundly wicked physiological weapon against them. This is well understood in the sociopathic personality of religious cult leaders such as JZR,, This will not be tolerated on EMF.

Perhaps... this thread is a good place to explore the psychology of why certain RSE supporters feel the need to attack EMF
and its posters so unjustifiably and often vehemently nasty.
I think its well worth lifting this RSE rock.... and see whats lurking beneath...!
How does that saying go?
When life hands you lemons ? you make lemonade.?
even an extra sour one...!


Here is a link to DanceTheWind's website.
Home Studio
http://ampm24-7.com/default.aspx

David.

Dance - a word of friendly advice regarding the Rockumentary...be very careful with using or referencing any of JZ's material without consulting with her legal department first. JZ is a pitbull with even her current and former students when it comes to them doing ANYTHING that remotely resembles her/Ramtha stuff. And she loves to run to court as a first resort.

The Abraham-Hicks club is pretty gentle and when they got the boot out of The Secret, they went on with life graciously.

Would not want you to mistake JZ Knight has taking that kind of approach. She seems to love the courtroom attention and then acts innocent when she tells the current students that she has to do it that way to protect Ramtha's teachings. She's left several well meaning people completely stunned as she's put them out of business.

So sad, human behavior can be at times. I visited "Dance's" link as listed above, and it appears so gentle and sweet.
Then I re-read the vitriol, Dance, and my mind cannot connect the two. Are those your words? Are you one of the gentle smiling faced?
How easily we can be swayed by a smile and kind words.
We must *always* question.

"Be the change you want" - I hear a lot.

C'mon.
Out with it.
Enough of your jibberish Dance and put it all on the table or be gone.
I can't waste my time with any more of your crappy posts.

post the e-mails or be gone.

ESPECIALLY since I sent a kind PM to you regarding my copy of the rambles rockumentary.

You tell 'em, Tree!!! :) How about a nice "Tandav," Wind? (yanno, the great "Cosmic Dancer Shiva" does this at the end of each cyle/yuga)....Hmmm....so wonder where jzrk, again, got her "blue body dance?" (multitude of places, but the reason Shiva has a blue throat is because, in Hindu mythology, he drank poison).....

I still can't believe the great hall/old horse arena bears a huge portrait of this Hindu member of the trinity..

Time for the Tandav!!!!

DanceTheWind,

Respectful debate on EMF may at times include criticism and disagreement.
This is not censorship...! Perhaps you are confusing the two.
None of your posts on EMF " and that includes the old message board" have ever been Deleted or Edited.
Your "CryWolf bullying" tactics have now run its course.
I hope by my posting our private Emails....
You will take pause and understand that your attacks are totally irrational, unwarranted and mean spirited.
Please consider...
you still have an opportunity to enter a respectful and meaningful debate here on EMF.

There are kindred spirits here that deserve no less,

David.

********************

David McCarthy - DanceTheWind private Email exchange.


-------Original Message-------

From: DanceTheWind
Date: 12/20/2008 4:46:45 AM
To: David McCarthy
Subject: HEY GUY!!! (rocumentary)


So nice to catch up with you! Hey the site looks great, I havent learned the navigation but very cool that its all still underway and all.
Yes, David, if you would be so kind as to send us a copy of the rockumentary that would just be the greatest! our address is:
A-----& ------
149------
Beulah, MI 49617
(coming up on our 1st wedding anniversary! Dec 29th :o) and we're STILL IN LOVE! YAY!!)
Our "NewStory" project is (info on our site) a s l o w go but in the works, until we get a good video cam we are using our 2 stills and havent started the "innerviews" as of yet, although a couple are scheduled, or rather in the process of that. We're hoping to get a class C or A motorhome and hit the road again, ITCHY FEET syndrome! :o) or itchy butt! from sitting and watching the SNOW PILE UP!!!!
S------moved back to Bisbee az, I am sure you know, and shes HAPPY HAPPY HAPPY there, thats SO cool!
Sometimes we miss Yelm and Rainier ALOT and have often talked of moving back, there's JUST a feeling of place for us there... ahhh someday! Do you still plan to go back to New Zeland? We will get there eventaully and we'll stop at your place for HIGH fun! (you'll b there by then) M----- gonna catch up with you and we'll send this off 2 u... Love A-------


*****************

Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 09:44:34 -0800
From: David McCarthy
To: DanceTheWind
Subject: Re: HEY GUY!!! (rocumentary)
Hi Ann----DanceTheWind, M------

As soon as I've fixed a broken water pipe that succumbed to our arctic weather
I will write to you, I also have several DVD?s... I will post to you.. ASAP.
Chat soon......

David.

******************

-------Original Message-------

From: David McCarthy
Date: 12/23/2008 3:25:52 PM
To: Ann----------DanceTheWind

Subject: Package away..!


Hi Ann. Mi--------DanceTheWind,

Package away USPS. It should arrive by Monday/Tuesday.
Hey..Great web site by the way..Very creative. Your new home looks beautiful.

I'm planning to put together a web site of my own ASAP, featuring multi media backdrops to my music CD's.
I'm curios to hear about your "documentary" video project.
Is it an expose of RSE?
How do you both feel/think about JZ Knight and her RSE organization?,
has your perspective changed since you left Yelm?

Yes..We are still planning to move to NZ, But with the housing market at rock bottom,
it may take awhile to sell our place..
Your timing to get outa dodge was perfect. There have been over forty bank foreclosures in Clearwood this year.

Have a lovely Christmas...
Chat soon.
Call me anytime, 360 894 -----

David.

******************

From: David McCarthy
Date: 12/28/2008 8:59:06 PM
To: Ann??DanceTheWind
Subject:: Package away..!


Hi Ann------DanceTheWind, M------

I have a quick question for you both....

Is your "documentary project", intended to be somewhat supportive of the "Ramtha/RSE" doctrines in any way?
Perhaps....
There has been a misunderstanding about your intentions for requesting the Ramtha videos on EMF.
I ask this because.....
On your website, you provide a link to the BTO interview, where you are supportive of RSE.
I am sure this is not how you feel now, but I would really appreciate hearing from you.

Call me anytime...Tel 360 894 ----

With Kind Regards

David.

**************

-------Original Message-------

From: Ann---DanceTheWind
Date: 12/29/2008 5:18:03 AM
To: David McCarthy
Subject: RE: Package away..!

David

When you get you site up let me know! It has been alot of fun for me to create ours. I am still wanting to add the clips of our music, but not knowing just how, just yet. Its a free site builder and I may have to go thru a link to our my space page... its in the works.

You asked about our NewStory project, most of the info so far is on our site, as to what its about etc.

It is changing still and the idea isnt totally set yet, but No isn't any sort of "expose" about ANY teaching or non-teaching as the case may be ! (LOL) That said though, so far, the response we have is from those of us that are involved with the teachings of abraham, thru esther hicks. We've been in this work for about 3 yrs now and its a joy and a blessing on every level.
But... the film when it gets "put together" may b our story predominately, as that is the only one I am really interested in telling.(and living!)

As for me, my perspective on the whole RSE gig is still that of deep gratitude, as it was when I left. For me, (at that time in my life)
There really was no-where else on the planet that I could get to so easily to engage in such a wonderful experience, on ALL levels.

From the excitement of the ranch and all the beautiful people gathered there to the beauty of the disciplines. I personally met some of the most fantastic people I have ever met in the Yelm, area. Enough so that daily we still talk of moving back to Rainer or thereabouts...
Albeit those people, like yourself, are mostly ALL those that came for the school and subsequently LEFT it, but that in itself speaks well of their desire to go beyond (and then BEYOND again!)

I'll have M------- respond to the "gear" talk, Im havin fun singing my songs and us putting stuff together in the studio, that?s all I need to know!
Much love to you friend,

Ann-----DanceTheWind.

*********************

From: Ann----DanceTheWind
Date: 12/29/2008 5:26:31 AM
To: David McCarthy
Subject: RE: Package away..!

I posted my answer to your question on the emf site.
There are alot of things on our website that have to do with where we have come FROM, its like an introduction, so-to-speak... to us in general. Like telling someone where you were "born" doesnt really have much to do with WHO your parents were.


****************************

From: David McCarthy
Date: 12/29/2008 11:59:44 AM
To: Ann----DanceTheWind
Subject: An honest dialogue

Hello Ann----DanceThe Wind,

As for me, my perspective on the whole RSE gig is still that of deep gratitude, as it was when I left. For me,
(at that time in my life)there really was no-where else on the planet that I could get to so easily to engage in such a wonderful experience,
On ALL levels.

Ann----DanceTheWind

There is an EMF page specifically for RSE supporters such as yourself..
Your post/ request has been moved to this page.
Please?.
Return the package I sent ASAP.. Unopened if possible.
I also request of you both not to copy the DVD?s I sent to you.
Perhaps RSE will be happy to help you with your ?documentary?.

As for those those lives that have been utterly destroyed by Judith?s RSE deceptions.......
I expect you believe so deeply in "The law of attraction" philosophy.. That all is well.
And I understand where you are coming from.

In the spirit of ?the law of attraction??!
Please make your position clear on EMF that you are RSE supporters.

"the whole RSE gig is still that of deep gratitude"?.

And let?s all have an honest dialogue on EMF.

With kind regards,

David.

Tel 360 894 ----

**********************************

From: Ann------DanceTheWind
Date: 12/30/2008 8:25:24 AM
To: David McCarthy
Subject: HONEST? LOL

Thats a good name... Where ya been? Thats what we're all gonna ask u when we see u on the other side of the sea of sludge you've decided to live in.... Hey David? Where ya been?
Here's my "discussion"... (though I doubt you will read NOR hear it.... in THIS dimension anyway)

Oh, and as 4 the dvd's Thanks and they'll b on their way back 2 u soon. We have no desire for "copies" of them dont concern yourself. The crap is 5bazillion times stupider now then it was when I was actually THERE. Its embarassing. We enjoyed the one about the british guy though. Go team go.

PS believe it or not this comes with MUCH love, that you will never allow yourself to feel or know and WOW do I KNOW that is SOOOOOOOOOOOO your choice. But as Nicolas Cage told his imaginary twin brother in the movie Adaptation... (something along the lines of) it doesnt really matter weather someone "gets it" (about the love) all that matters is that its there and I KNOW IT.

ON YOUR HONEST SITE I ATTEMPTED TO POST THE FOLLOWING and AM SURE YOU WILL RE_WORD IT TO FEED YOUR MORE IMPORTANT AGENDA.

Your amazing David. These are my posts? hugh? really?
What a hoot, talk about an expose someone should do one on the game your running here on this site.
What a SHAME you ought to b ASHAMED of yourself USING these people like this.

Sorry, but the administrator has prevented you from sending private message

I get it, I got what I expected and by the way... what I WANTED.

Your just a F'in crazy as that Daffy Duck character your sooooooooo pissed at... JZ KNIGHT. You DESERVE EACHOTHER.

Most people (as creative as you) dont go to disney land for the kicks and giggles, get pissed off at what Mickey said and what Mickey did, move next door to Disney land and spend the rest of their LIVES pissin' & moanin' about how Mickey is a butt-head and is blah-blah-blah.... and even if SOME people (as creative as you) DID find they had done just this..... EVENTUALLY they may tire of the whole gig and live the LIFE they came here to...... (get this part) L I V E

Now David, considering I used many LETTERS of our alphabet in the above "POST" (haha) I suppose you could cut and paste EACH LETTER that YOU DESIRE in what ever CONFIGURATION that you desire and then QUOTE ME!!!! and post THAT under my name, go ahead I am giving YOU permission... OH wait a minuet (like the dance) you dont NEED MY PERMISSION!!! LOL

YOUR the head GURU here in this little corner of disney land.

DanceTheWind.

Dear David

I'm sorry you received the posts you share above from AM. Keep up the good work; you are reaching people and I appreciate your honesty.

Sara

I quote myself from my post under Marjoe --"The kicker for me about this type of personality is how love-able the person is ? and in fact, you/I sincerely love them ? and they ultimately hurt us one way or another, time and time again. They betray us, or accuse and judge us, curse at us or just abandon us- always making us feel wrong." Dance was all lovey and supportive - then when you disagree, the judgment and accusations and bashing start -- sounds very scarily like JZ and some others who post here.

Yes, I agree with Another - the 180 degree shift was stunning - as soon as you made a clear request/upheld a boundary/were not in total agreement.

I feel the same as AD360 and Sara. We see the "smiling faces" (that sometimes tell tales, sadly).

Wind, you demonstrate one "dimension" on your website and within your early emails to David. THEN - the words used change into something unrecognizable. Get help. Quickly, trying to see the "light" within ALL of us. Why not rise into the highest level of humanity that one can, and not criticize so harshly, one such as David, who has the chutzpah to reveal truths of scams and rape of one's spirituality.

I would advise anyone to steer clear of Wind's site, simply due to the duplicity and deceit. It's so sad, when one of the most important things this world needs to endure is a sense of caring, true caring, and no further deception.

I'd also like to ask Wind, since Wind obviously believes in the law of attraction, what she/he intended to "attract" with such vitriolic words. Stop the duplicity, please, please. Be true to oneself, or at least try, in all manners.

I've found in losing several close to me, that I do not grieve for them, I grieve for myself and the fact that "I" can no longer enjoy their laughter, their touch. Go deep within and search, Wind. Search for that very feeling that provoked you to respond to David so harshly. It's the only manner in which we can truly know what we are in terms of what we "attract." Blessings to you during this time of crisis.

Wise words, G2G. Dance the wind, someone is caring enough to ask you to get help. Do it now! What were you feeling when you posted those words to David? You may not be able to get to it on your own.

Sara

Maybe this is a na?ve suggestion ?or a difficult one to implement, I?m not sure, but I?m wondering if it would be a good idea to ask everyone who registers on EMF to declare their ?status? before they post . . ..something like:
- current RSE student
- not current but still believing
- ex RSE student, recovering
- family member
- other???
. .oh yeah, and the strict admonition to ?BE IMPECCABLE IN YOUR DECLARATION?!!!

I wonder if this would help deter any ?wolves in sheep?s clothing? out there ?probably not .. ..but it might ?.DancetheWind?s initial post sounded so friendly and if I had a copy of the Rockumentary, I probably woulda sent it on to her because it sounded like she was a good friend of yours David ?.and then things took such a sudden turn . ?

Anyway, just a thought.

When you said you were gonna put ALL the emails here... I was hoping you would. And mayb that would bring peace, but nope.( Peace anit the point here ... is it?) Aint gonna happen. Some of the missing info, not all, was from my husband, Michael, who also had some things to say about RSE... and since we are married and have this 24-7 gig going, he is aware of what "happeded" here with you.

I do want to thank you David, though, because this whole deal with you has really clarified alot for me.
So much so, that because of this, I am actually in the process of starting my project! This is so cool!

I thought I might scrap the deal, or at least put it back on the back burner, since its inception was a few years ago at this point. But the fact that YOU could DECIDE of your own that I am currently a student of RSE and stick my posts here... what a hoot! Now... I am even being accused of being JZ! as well as Ram, and someone who.... FARTS??? alot??? How funni!

yes... this is leading edge healing going on ...

We sent your dvd's back today. Thanks, as I said eariler in my emails and posts, it was very cool to watch them, on many levels for many reasons. I am shocked I ever ended up in Yelm. But.. then I would not have met you... and been able to have this wonderfully fun time!

To all who have suggested I GET HELP. Thank you for your concern and I am here to say... I have. I have help. I always have, as have each of you.

The three months Jan-Mar 07 that I used this site for what I believed to be the "intention" behind it... were exactly what I needed to do what I intended to do. Remove myself from a confused and really "sad" at the core "teaching"... by a woman who got lost somewhere along the way.

I can love her, and leave her... I can love her "vision" and leave the rest of what she is doing and created behind.

Because in the end, its ALL GOD. We're ALL GOD.

I can leave RSE and STILL VALUE what I did there, the experiences I had, the people I met, ALL that I WANT to appreiciate.... is MINE to do so with

I know... I know... I talk and you'll hear some other crap and turn it all around so once, yet again...
YOU have been the victum of some... whatever! Fill in the blank.

Thanks for the memories though gang... its just what I needed.

And I deeply wish you ALL the absolute very best you can allow yourselves to have.
And you can take that, twsit it up and make it out to b whatever you need to hear.

AnnMarie aka Dance
[/u]

maybe I missed something.
I got confused when David asked for his DVD's back.
I don't know why he would ask for them back, particularly un opened.
This just seems kind of "Indian giving"-ish.
On another hand, if David perceives she is a supporter of RSE, then I can see why
he would not want to contribute to Wind's documentary in any way, shape, or form.
She is not saying she is a supporter of RSE.
She is just saying she got alot OUT of RSE and has moved on.
Plenty of people on EMF have said that they got alot of "good" things out of RSE.
But most will add that RSE and the whole idea of rambles does more harm than
good to most people's brains and pysches.
then she lashes back at David for being some sort of guru- which is not true,
but I can see if one has come from RSE, they might see David as that way.
That definitely is a limited and too-close-in-time-from-the-experience perspective.

I think David has shown utmost graciousness in his exchanges
and Wind has not. She got rather ugly.

But other than her ugly reaction,
What is the whole point of this anyway?

I think it is just another form of someone "moving on" to another group, or cult.
And we know plenty of people who have done that.
The cult-hopper thing.
And if they usually do not see this as a cult hopping,
it certainly is expressed with such, uh, hmmm...how shall I say....
sharp, vitriolic tongues.
But, that is part of the group think.
All one can do is draw a boundary of not allowing such
abuse for oneself.

Just let her go on her merry "Secret" way.
There was plenty enough information hijacked from Dale Carnegie
in that little venture.

Some of the missing info, not all, was from my husband, Michael,

DanceTheWind,

Michael was neither vitriolic nor deceptive in his personal email to me regarding RSE..
This does not give you a free license to lash out with your vitriol and disinformation.
It is your atrocious behavior and reluctance to enter into a meaningful and honest dialogue that is of concern here.
Also, Something we have hardly touched upon so far"...what were your intentions to use the RSE DVD's I sent to you?

This was a unique opportunity for you to take responsibility for your actions....
But sadly..... yours is a typical RSE mindset of zero accountability, while deflecting the issues elseware.

David.

*********

Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2008 20:59:06 -0800
From: LARSE@fairpoint.net
To: DanceTheWind
Subject: Fw: Package away..!

Hi AnnMarie. Michael,

I have a quick question for you both....

Is your "documentary project", intended to be somewhat supportive of the "Ramtha/RSE" doctrines in any way?
Perhaps.... There has been a misunderstanding about your intentions for requesting the Ramtha videos on EMF.
I ask this because.....
On your website, you provide a link to the BTO interview, where you are supportive of RSE.
I am sure this is not how you feel now, but I would really appreciate hearing from you.

Call me anytime...Tel 360 894 ----

With Kind Regards

David.

-------Original Message-------

From: Michael
Date: 12/29/2008 6:01:08 AM
To: David McCarthy
Subject: RE: Response from Michael

this is Michael here ...

I am at this place in life , where I am very aware of how immediately "life " responds to whatever I focus on . I am more interested in being happy and living my dream life than ever ! and this awareness constantly reminds me to turn away from whatever is not an absolute YES , to whatever IS an absolute yes ( which of course changes throughout the day and covers any subject-area of my life ) .I am thrilled with this guidance and reminder . Our BTO interview was BEFORE I had ever been there or seen Ramtha JZ , save for videos from the library and several books that I read .
So RSE only comes up for me , in ways that are elements or remembrances that I appreciate about my time there. ( one 9 day Assay event and 1 or 2 evening ones ) . I guess the simplest way for me to state my feeling RE RSE and JZ is, I found the attendees to be very interesting and JZ to be an outrageous caricature (sp) as , in over the top , not her Service Marked -Trademarked use of the word "outrageous" -HA ! I love that people want to find out about life , to know and to feel empowered in LIVING IT . It does not feel empowering to " go after " anyone and JZ seems to me , to be lost in her own creation. I hope she finds her way out of this drama of hers.
I am much more interested in " onward and upward " vs, regretting or feeling remorseful about something I went through . I am having much more FUN ! focusing on our CDs and realizing all the creative energy to distract myself for the past - ANY PART OF IT !

First of all..
Thank you everyone for your post's and insights.

But other than her ugly reaction,
What is the whole point of this anyway?

Tree,
I thought I already answered that question by saying:
Perhaps... this thread is a good place to explore the psychology of why certain RSE supporters feel the need to attack EMF and its posters so unjustifiably and often vehemently nasty.

I believe DanceTheWind came here solely to use the resources of EMF to promote her own agenda,
This having absolutely nothing to do with the stated purpose of EMF.
Unfortunately I only realized this after posting the package to her; it was certainly not intended as a gift,
Or for trade, But a tool given in the spirit of EMF, to be used for what I understood to be a ?documentary? exposing the true nature of RSE.
I feel it is important to open this particular ?Pandora?s box? to educate ourselves by exploring the psychology of how these people operate, that in recognizing and exposing these traits , we are better able defend ourselves, and just as important, to heal and purge our own hearts and minds.
These people may come bearing flowers and kind words, very disarming,
but in truth, they are just tools of trade for a ?snake with a halo?!
They will use whatever ?spiritual/ religious? dogma that works to effectively get what they want,
They will trample anyone who dares challenge their ?spiritual? megalomania and selfishness.
When unmasked they are adept at creating a diversion, similar to a shill kicking over the gambling table to make their getaway.
They do terrible harm in our society; they go unchallenged mainly because they are too slippery to get a handle on, without creating even more confusion and distraction.
Perhaps?. it is wise just to stay away from these ?Tar Babies??! As Joe may call them.
But I think together, we have the strength to hold these little monsters up for accountability,
Because they are in fact, an integral part of our own minds that have been seductively poisoned,
That initially entrapped us into RSE.
And as a passing thought in this late hour..I also believe that..

It is only in the combined light of each other, can we truly see...
to find our way home.

EMF?2009 GuruDaveyJi

chuckle.

My dearest local guru,
Thank you for that explanation (just teasing about the guru part).

I see your point, and I think I re-iterated it as well.
Even when people group hop, they still cannot think totally for themselves
( as is evidenced in the e-mail exchanges)
and then when they don't get exactly what they want,
or they are mis undeerstood,
they lambaste everyone in the way.

and this awareness constantly reminds me to turn away from whatever is not an absolute YES , to whatever IS an absolute yes ( which of course changes throughout the day and covers any subject-area of my life )

his entire letter smacks of group think verbiage.
It is actually enlightening to read because I know other people who have left
RSE only to join other groups,
and then they come back to have a conversation with you,
only to use THAT groups' verbiage (NEXIUM comes to mind as well as Landmark).
YOU are thinking you are speaking English,
and here they come at you with the arsenal of new vocabulary, which they think is superior
to standard English,
and then they get irate anyway. because you are not "getting" what they are saying.
Meaning, they didn't get their way.
it is all about them and however the wind blows throughout their day,
THAT is what they are concerned about. How every little change comes from their thoughts
and how it all can better serve them.

My dearest Splinter-Group-Guru Tree..... ..

In seriousness, in response to your post above, I also think the arrogance and superiority are for some, or better said, "coming" from some, feels to me, like just another version of too many versions out there already of human insecurities trying to find reasons to make themselves feel better about themselves. The same way all prejudices and exclusionary thinking separates us. It is usually, ultimately, about giving the instigator a reason to feel "better than." And destructive groups feed on this.

Any kind of exclusionary thinking or philosphy that encourages superiority or lack based on what one "is", or is not, is just wrong, imo.